I'm in the worst place I've been in years (vent) AND a question regarding exercise

[Ahlstrom]

I'll get the question out of the way first:

Does anyone have conflicting results of how they feel after exercise? For example some days during and after lifting weights and/or cardio I feel great and high on endorphins. My anxiety will practically be whisked away. But other times during and after exercise I feel really anxious. Like the adrenaline didn't go through the proper.... tubes? I don't know. Does this happen to anyone else? Is it just related to the amygdala and there's nothing I can do to fix it or is it related to the cortex and I can train the brain to recognize it's not some sort of threat?

----------------------------------------

Anyways yeah I just wanted to vent in hopes it will relieve some, even just a little bit of anxiety. Perhaps I can see yalls insights to my situation too.

A brief background: Had depression since I was 10, when I was 19 I drank too much and went to the hospital where I puked it all out. The day after that I was helping my mother garden and decided to smoke some weed and got hit with my first panic attack. After that I joined this forum. Fast forward maybe 4 years and my anxiety is better, but I decide to start drinking caffeine - which really jacked up my nervous system. Took some years to heal after that. Eventually I arrive to a few months ago where I was doing quite dandy on my 1mg of Klonopin a day. I got stupid again and decided to have just a little sip of caffeine and of course next thing you know I was drinking quite a lot and dampening it out with my Klonopin. This lead to me taking more than I was supposed to until the point where I ran out and had 5 days until my next RX was filled. I freaked out and called my psych. He told me he wouldn't give me more. Understandable. It's my fault. I didn't cold turkey off of it but I did a suddenly massive reduction in how much I was taking (1/4th for 2 days and then 1/8th)

...on the third day on reduced dose I woke up in complete agony from Klonopin withdrawal. Words really can't describe how awful it is. Well, eh, I guess they can. Imagine you have a terrible flu but don't feel hot or cold nor does your body hurt. Now imagine with that flu-like symptoms your whole body is lit on fire to the point where you feel like you need to pace back and forth to get the flames to calm down. Ok, now add on this: sometimes the fire gets so hot that you start to solidify, and you completely freeze up as if trapped in a cacoon. Now if that's not enough you lose your appetite. You lose your desire to drink water. The smell of food nearly makes you puke and it's dang near impossible to eat anything down except for when the symptoms surge. I say surge because they do go down. It's like a roller coaster in hell.

I couldn't take it for 3 days. By the end of the 1st day I checked in to a nearby hospital, with a dry mouth having little ability to drink or eat. They gave me fluids and some diazepam to stop the withdrawal, gave me a script for more diazepam, and sent me on my way.

So eventually I got my Klonopin again 20 or so days ago. The withdrawal hell is over but my body has been tweaked and I'm still suffering from increased anxiety.

The first week back on Klonopin I would only get triggered by bumps or doors closing from my room mates after evening started. It would send me into a sort of alert I can imagine war-vets have.

The next week that stopped, but I would have bad anxiety in the morning.

Now it's the third week back on Klonopin and my anxiety seems to be consistent throughout the day. Depression is coming to the forefront, which I usually haven't experienced in the form of sadness, only laziness and lack of motivation.

It all really sucks. I'm trying to work out but have injured parts I was too stingey to go to physical therapy for when they happened back in August. Since last August I've done near no exercise, which was what was healing me. Now (related to the question above) there seem to be certain days when exercise just makes it worse.

I can't relax. I am near constantly on edge. I just suffer through it. Kind of try to ignore it. I still have diazepam left but I am trying to not use any at all - have only used some twice in the past 20 days.

Of course the quarantine isn't making it any better. Luckily I just got approved for a gym (1 hour, 3 times a week, because of limited capacity) so hopefully I can start to exercise some of the symptoms off, even if my cortisol makes it worse... I had to go to the gym pretty consistently before my body started to crave the stress and cortisol and it oddly enough started to cure my anxiety. School's are shut down. I can't actually go anywhere.

I'll likely never touch caffeine again and always be more mindful of my health. So yeah... thanks for reading... just in a terrible place right now. I try to see the good in it.

[gypsylee]

I'll get the question out of the way first:

Does anyone have conflicting results of how they feel after exercise? For example some days during and after lifting weights and/or cardio I feel great and high on endorphins. My anxiety will practically be whisked away. But other times during and after exercise I feel really anxious. Like the adrenaline didn't go through the proper.... tubes? I don't know. Does this happen to anyone else? Is it just related to the amygdala and there's nothing I can do to fix it or is it related to the cortex and I can train the brain to recognize it's not some sort of threat?

----------------------------------------

Anyways yeah I just wanted to vent in hopes it will relieve some, even just a little bit of anxiety. Perhaps I can see yalls insights to my situation too.

A brief background: Had depression since I was 10, when I was 19 I drank too much and went to the hospital where I puked it all out. The day after that I was helping my mother garden and decided to smoke some weed and got hit with my first panic attack. After that I joined this forum. Fast forward maybe 4 years and my anxiety is better, but I decide to start drinking caffeine - which really jacked up my nervous system. Took some years to heal after that. Eventually I arrive to a few months ago where I was doing quite dandy on my 1mg of Klonopin a day. I got stupid again and decided to have just a little sip of caffeine and of course next thing you know I was drinking quite a lot and dampening it out with my Klonopin. This lead to me taking more than I was supposed to until the point where I ran out and had 5 days until my next RX was filled. I freaked out and called my psych. He told me he wouldn't give me more. Understandable. It's my fault. I didn't cold turkey off of it but I did a suddenly massive reduction in how much I was taking (1/4th for 2 days and then 1/8th)

...on the third day on reduced dose I woke up in complete agony from Klonopin withdrawal. Words really can't describe how awful it is. Well, eh, I guess they can. Imagine you have a terrible flu but don't feel hot or cold nor does your body hurt. Now imagine with that flu-like symptoms your whole body is lit on fire to the point where you feel like you need to pace back and forth to get the flames to calm down. Ok, now add on this: sometimes the fire gets so hot that you start to solidify, and you completely freeze up as if trapped in a cacoon. Now if that's not enough you lose your appetite. You lose your desire to drink water. The smell of food nearly makes you puke and it's dang near impossible to eat anything down except for when the symptoms surge. I say surge because they do go down. It's like a roller coaster in hell.

I couldn't take it for 3 days. By the end of the 1st day I checked in to a nearby hospital, with a dry mouth having little ability to drink or eat. They gave me fluids and some diazepam to stop the withdrawal, gave me a script for more diazepam, and sent me on my way.

So eventually I got my Klonopin again 20 or so days ago. The withdrawal hell is over but my body has been tweaked and I'm still suffering from increased anxiety.

The first week back on Klonopin I would only get triggered by bumps or doors closing from my room mates after evening started. It would send me into a sort of alert I can imagine war-vets have.

The next week that stopped, but I would have bad anxiety in the morning.

Now it's the third week back on Klonopin and my anxiety seems to be consistent throughout the day. Depression is coming to the forefront, which I usually haven't experienced in the form of sadness, only laziness and lack of motivation.

It all really sucks. I'm trying to work out but have injured parts I was too stingey to go to physical therapy for when they happened back in August. Since last August I've done near no exercise, which was what was healing me. Now (related to the question above) there seem to be certain days when exercise just makes it worse.

I can't relax. I am near constantly on edge. I just suffer through it. Kind of try to ignore it. I still have diazepam left but I am trying to not use any at all - have only used some twice in the past 20 days.

Of course the quarantine isn't making it any better. Luckily I just got approved for a gym (1 hour, 3 times a week, because of limited capacity) so hopefully I can start to exercise some of the symptoms off, even if my cortisol makes it worse... I had to go to the gym pretty consistently before my body started to crave the stress and cortisol and it oddly enough started to cure my anxiety. School's are shut down. I can't actually go anywhere.

I'll likely never touch caffeine again and always be more mindful of my health. So yeah... thanks for reading... just in a terrible place right now. I try to see the good in it.

Hey there :)

My short answer is a definite yes. I can't give you any proper scientific answers but I've experienced that myself and read the same thing on forums from other people. Some people even avoid exercise because it makes them feel anxious. The obvious reason for that is it increases your heart rate just like anxiety.

Thinking about that and my own experience, I'm guessing it's a psychological thing. In my case it's related to how I feel *before* exercising. I have an exercise bike at home and there have been times I'm having a full-on panic attack, so I get on the bike and go flat out. Once my heart rate goes down I usually feel better. But other times I might just have mild anxiety and afterwards (even after my heart rate goes down) I feel no better and then feel more anxious because I worry about it not working! So you see what I mean? How you feel afterward is relative to how you felt before, and often we aren't even aware of how anxious we are beforehand.

One thing I've tried when I've had the "I don't feel any better" worry is deep breathing. (In fact, if I had to choose between exercise and breathing as remedies for anxiety I'd say breathing.) But doing the breathing after the exercise worked. There are lots of videos on YT -- this one is really good:

https://youtu.be/4Lb5L-VEm34


Another thing I wanted to point out is that Klonopin is (a lot?) stronger than diazepam. Doctors don't even prescribe Klonopin here, or at least I've never had it. There might be some difference other than the strength as well. Diazepam has the least severe withdrawal symptoms of the benzos as far as I know. So if you need to use benzos, go with diazepam.

Hope that helps!

--Gypsy

[MainerMikeBrown]

When I do physical exercise, such as going out for a walk or a run around my neighborhood, I usually get the runner's high...but not always.

I've never found that doing exercise increases or decreases my anxiety, even when I used to be a very nervous person years ago.

The only time I feel a little bit low emotionally after getting exercise is if I wear myself out physically by overdoing exercise. But if I'm careful not to overdo it, I don't have that issue.

[Ahlstrom]

Gypsy and Mike thanks for the replies.

Is this forum dying? Compared to when I joined in 2012 it's so slow now :(

I got into a gym and have been doing physical therapy. Things are looking better in general.

Yesterday at 3pm I ate a 1500 choclate cookie and half a pizza. I'm obese BMI and by 9pm I had one of the worst anxiety attacks of my life. It brought me to tears and I'm the sort of dude that may cry maybe like once a year. I wasn't able to fall asleep until 2am and that's after downing a lot of benzos. My heart rate and panic was way too insane and I couldn't fall asleep... I am used to waking up at 7am and so my body decided it would be a fantastic idea to have me wake up at 6:30am, leaving me sleep deprived which is the WORST POSSIBLE THING for my anxiety personally. And now as the sun sets, and after downing drugs again trying to calm my heart rate which is already high from sleep prevation... oh my gosh this is an endless cycle. Not as hard as withdrawal but oh my gosh I hope I sleep tonight and I can return to relative normal again. I can't believe pizza and a cookie all did this to me.

[gypsylee]

Gypsy and Mike thanks for the replies.

Is this forum dying? Compared to when I joined in 2012 it's so slow now :(

I got into a gym and have been doing physical therapy. Things are looking better in general.

Yesterday at 3pm I ate a 1500 choclate cookie and half a pizza. I'm obese BMI and by 9pm I had one of the worst anxiety attacks of my life. It brought me to tears and I'm the sort of dude that may cry maybe like once a year. I wasn't able to fall asleep until 2am and that's after downing a lot of benzos. My heart rate and panic was way too insane and I couldn't fall asleep... I am used to waking up at 7am and so my body decided it would be a fantastic idea to have me wake up at 6:30am, leaving me sleep deprived which is the WORST POSSIBLE THING for my anxiety personally. And now as the sun sets, and after downing drugs again trying to calm my heart rate which is already high from sleep prevation... oh my gosh this is an endless cycle. Not as hard as withdrawal but oh my gosh I hope I sleep tonight and I can return to relative normal again. I can't believe pizza and a cookie all did this to me.

Well it's a mystery to me how it hasn't died because it's got no admin! I jumped ship in 2018 and when I googled couldn't find it. I didn't look very hard, just assumed it had finally died. Then I spotted it somehow and Dahila was still here, so I messaged her and here we are :) I loved this forum. It's like the Wild West of the internet haha.

Sorry I gotta go. I'll reply to the actual anxiety part later.

[gypsylee]

Gypsy and Mike thanks for the replies.

Is this forum dying? Compared to when I joined in 2012 it's so slow now :(

I got into a gym and have been doing physical therapy. Things are looking better in general.

Yesterday at 3pm I ate a 1500 choclate cookie and half a pizza. I'm obese BMI and by 9pm I had one of the worst anxiety attacks of my life. It brought me to tears and I'm the sort of dude that may cry maybe like once a year. I wasn't able to fall asleep until 2am and that's after downing a lot of benzos. My heart rate and panic was way too insane and I couldn't fall asleep... I am used to waking up at 7am and so my body decided it would be a fantastic idea to have me wake up at 6:30am, leaving me sleep deprived which is the WORST POSSIBLE THING for my anxiety personally. And now as the sun sets, and after downing drugs again trying to calm my heart rate which is already high from sleep prevation... oh my gosh this is an endless cycle. Not as hard as withdrawal but oh my gosh I hope I sleep tonight and I can return to relative normal again. I can't believe pizza and a cookie all did this to me.

My earliest memories of insomnia are from when I was about 5yo. At the moment anything more than a couple of hours at a time is good (without drugs). I've got hormonal things going on but it's been an issue most of my life. It's what started my alcoholism at 17yo. The vicious cycle is of course, the harder you try to sleep the less likely you are to fall asleep. The only real solution is not caring, which is a paradox, or drugs. Breathing can do the trick (I'm talking 20 mins or more, not a few deep breaths) but not guaranteed. Apparently sleep disorders are epidemic now though so you're not alone. Problem is you still feel like the only person on the planet who can't sleep. I don't know.. I'm speaking to the doc tomorrow about some Valium because I just can't deal with it.

[Ahlstrom]

My earliest memories of insomnia are from when I was about 5yo. At the moment anything more than a couple of hours at a time is good (without drugs). I've got hormonal things going on but it's been an issue most of my life. It's what started my alcoholism at 17yo. The vicious cycle is of course, the harder you try to sleep the less likely you are to fall asleep. The only real solution is not caring, which is a paradox, or drugs. Breathing can do the trick (I'm talking 20 mins or more, not a few deep breaths) but not guaranteed. Apparently sleep disorders are epidemic now though so you're not alone. Problem is you still feel like the only person on the planet who can't sleep. I don't know.. I'm speaking to the doc tomorrow about some Valium because I just can't deal with it.

Yeah, I've been popping back Valium (not touching my Klonopin) for the last 2 nights too and it's not doing anything. You're right in saying it's best not to care at this point. Just don't care my legs are shaking. Don't care my heart feels like it's going 120BPM when it's like 75BPM... don't care.

I did some get Trzadone last night and took half of what they recommend and it knocked me out pretty well. I got maybe 5 or 6 hours of sleep. Still not much and I feel anxious... although it might be the Trazadone making me anxious. Idk. I pray I take some tonight, fall asleep, and get at least 7 hours. Should reset me.

[Dahila]

My insomnia is almost gone, just half on night once in two or three months, It is like that when I started CBD oil mine is made from Hemp not marijuana, less than 0.003% of THC. I sleep like baby and Body scan with John Kabat zinn put me to sleep like 5 minutes into his lecture :))

[gypsylee]

Yeah, I've been popping back Valium (not touching my Klonopin) for the last 2 nights too and it's not doing anything. You're right in saying it's best not to care at this point. Just don't care my legs are shaking. Don't care my heart feels like it's going 120BPM when it's like 75BPM... don't care.

I did some get Trzadone last night and took half of what they recommend and it knocked me out pretty well. I got maybe 5 or 6 hours of sleep. Still not much and I feel anxious... although it might be the Trazadone making me anxious. Idk. I pray I take some tonight, fall asleep, and get at least 7 hours. Should reset me.

I know.. I've gotten better at not caring because I've had insomnia for decades but I still have awful panic attacks because of it. You can't think rationally AT ALL when you're in the middle of it, especially if the vicious cycle has been escalating.

As usual, one of the biggest problems is the myths about sleep such as everybody needing 8 hours a night, every night, to be at the top of their game. I need about 6 I've worked out with 40 years of experience. Some people 4 and some people 12. I think that's the "normal" range. As people get older they sleep less and less, teenagers need the most sleep and whoever came up with "sleep like a baby" must have been insane.. Babies are the worst sleepers EVER (apart from me lol).

[Ponder]

Disregard. I'm lost again.

[IAmCamille]

It's hard to distinguish the feeling of anxiety and the post-workout physical results since they are pretty similar and we are quite aware of what anxiety feels like. It's really tricky and as to what can fix this, I cannot say. Maybe, it's all about sorting out the psychological approach to things.