Dave's Diary

[Dahila]

I made my decision and I am looking for a new one, no one can be worse that this ancient, botox filled B

[jessed03]

Hey Dave. Yeah, I've been a big fan of Watts since I discovered his talks on Youtube several years ago. He's a fantastic orator. Reminds me of Jon Kab Zinn in a way. I could listen to them both read from a restaurant menu and would find it fascinating!

[Ponder]

Hi D - Remember when I was going through the same thing and I finally made my move. The next one I found was in many ways as limited by the system in which they are bound, however having a fresh perspective on both fronts did yeild better results. If only more of us moved like so when complacency holds as all back. $$$$ often dictate for many, however it cost's nothing to keep moving and I have no issue with doctor hopping as I am not into the drugs! : ) Moving is a great way to gain new perspective regardless of blame. It's great for the brain and helps us to make better choices. All the best with moving on and please do let us know how you go.
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Hi J - Yea ... I thought exactly the same when I heard him as well. I was like "COOL - sweet vibe like John Kabat Zinn" Does he narrate any of his books? I think I will make a playlist on my channel with some of his lectures. I listening to a quick one last night - it was pretty good. → The Trap Of Seeking- Alan Watts (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8aIYX0TKxQ&list=PLoLa-tlFMS_bxEvUKM3PkiS7CG6nCVk-X&index=3) Nice Audio that compliments his tone quite well - The Content even better!

I just finished taking in Zen Mediation Magic - Secrets to Finding the Time for Peace of Mind, Every Day by Jennifer Brookes. The content in that reminded my a Lot of John Kabat Zinn - mostly towards the end of the book re meditations methods, hints and tips. I'm now ready to take on Allan Watts - The Book ...

I could not help it though ... I bought a second one by Allan as well → Become What You Are, by Alan Watts (http://www.dailygood.org/pdf/ij.php?tid=474) I just link that to a book description PDF as I am yet to find that book available online. Kind of makes me feel a little better having spent the $$$ for that. LOL if you can find it for free, but please do share if you do. From the Tittle and the description this particular books seems to be in tune with John Kabat Zinn's "Wherever You Go There You Are" - Audio Book. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsUZLrBKegY&list=PLyp5AYS-aSffy9hudBc9t6PzX3ZFwyC2G) Here is another cool play list with John giving varioius presentations (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gViiux9ANMk&list=PLz4zrkp6mzieBjBj0I54Ir1UN0JT50iMP).
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Please excuse all the Links & what not. I just want to make available these resources for anyone reading on as this "stuff" really does have the potential to do so much more than one's current aids. Like for sure people should go with what works, but we got to keep asking ourselves ... "Is it really working for me?" If not then keep seeking until there is nothing left to seek. For me that is the only way to get out of the trap to which Allan refers in his above 10 minute chat on the Trap of Seeking. Of course the idea is not to think at all which brings me to my last point of my morning post:

Much of all this information goes in circles just like that of our own minds! Have you ever noticed how a lot of people when giving reviews express a frustration with how they feel the Author repeats much of the same stuff. I have hear many people say the of Echart Tolle and now have read people saying the same thing about Watts. I smiled when once again, hearing people sigh over the same old stuff. hehe ... SEE - even I am going through it with the way people react. lol

Anyways - for me it is part and parcel of the process and actually ties into concepts expressed in quantum physics. I won't get into that. : ) - Just saying is all. I love seeing something new from the same old view!!! That's where it's at Jesse and D ... I swear that how it works for me. (Man, I got to find a new writing style - forgive the drumming beat and the rhymes)

All this literature and teachings has grounded me in a time I really needed.

Now is time for my to get on with my day and see how that falls into place. Oh Yea - I remember one last book title from the one I just finished ... a recommended one in a book list during the conclusion of my last read. That I think might go well in here under the medication section. I have not fully reviewed it but will drop the name of Title in here before moving on.

Meditation, Not Medication - (https://www.amazon.com/Meditation-Not-Medication-Mind-Body-Connection-ebook/dp/B00APOUTOS)


In fact I will share the conclusion that lists more books like it on Meditation: It's lengthy and I don't expect anyone to read - Just logging it in as another book done. :)
____________

I post it in another post as not to exceed the charter limit ...

[Ponder]

Zen Mediation Magic - Secrets to Finding the Time for Peace of Mind, Every Day by Jennifer Brookes:

Conclusion

If you’ve gained nothing else from reading this book, you’ve learned that you really don’t need this book at all. Oh yes, another Zen paradox.
It may seem paradoxical, but it’s true. Once you’ve cultivated bringing Zen awareness to all of your activities, you’ll discover you no longer need the guidance this book provides. You may want to keep it and file it for a handy reference. When you feel your grasp of the present moment slipping away and you’re falling back into the past or careening toward the future, open it.
Other than that, your own emotions and feelings will be your guide. If you’ve learned that, then you’ve absorbed the main lesson of the book.
Don’t Just Do Something, Sit There

You now can feel confident in the times you just sit – experiencing Zen. There’s nothing shameful or lazy about it. In fact, the time you sit quietly and are keenly attuned to your thoughts or to the sounds around you, is bound to be your most productive period of your day. Guaranteed.

Don’t worry what the world may think. When you emerge from your Zen space, you’ll be more energized, more creative, and more thankful for every present moment you experience.
Speaking of the present, there’s no time like it. Why not start right now in putting these activities into practice?

Also By Jennifer Brooks:

Everyday Mindfulness - Change Your Life by Living in the Present (Mindfulness for Beginners) – Jennifer Brooks

Stressed out? Burnt out? Just plain tired of trying to keep up with the frenzied pace of the world? What would you say if I told you that in just a few short minutes a day, you can change that stressed state to one of serenity and peace?
It’s called mindful meditation, and it’s been used for thousands of years by wise individuals worldwide. Now, all the benefits these people “claimed” they were receiving are being verified through rigorous clinical studies.
Reduce stress? Mindful meditation can do this.

Support regular heart functions? Sitting quietly in the moment can help.
Gaining a new perspective on life? It’s right here waiting for you to sit and acquire it.
If you’re searching for a new way of living, a second chance at living life more fully, then mindful meditation is for you. Why waste another moment of your life, dwelling in the past or worrying about the future? Isn’t it time you start living in the present? Get this book today and gain the secrets that meditation holds to bring you a happier and healthier life!



The Four Day Meditation Solution - Use the Power of Meditation to Transform Your Life from Ordinary to Extraordinary ... In Just Four Days – Jennifer Brooks

Imagine boosting your power of concentration by ten times your current level in four short days. This easy-to-follow meditation system virtually ensures you a radical increase in your ability to focus on what’s most important to you.
Based on the latest published well respected scientific research, this volume tells you how one simple change in your habits can produce this dramatic improvement. But it doesn’t stop there. It goes one step beyond, giving you the tools you need to ensure your four days of turbocharged concentration lasts a lifetime.

Meditation is no longer an esoteric, irrelevant activity practiced solely by those searching for spiritual enlightenment. The act of stilling the mind and body now has proven to have practical benefits: Benefits to improve your productivity, your stress level – even your overall health, by reducing your risks of developing many diseases associated with the aging process.
Discover what untold beneficial secrets even four days of meditation hold for you. Then learn how to turn these four days into a lifetime of health, happiness and overall success.
Pick up The Four Day Meditation Solution - Use the Power of Meditation to Transform Your Life from Ordinary to Extraordinary … In Just Four Days and enhance your life starting today!



Meditation, Not Medication (https://www.amazon.com/Meditation-Not-Medication-Mind-Body-Connection-ebook/dp/B00APOUTOS) - Heal Yourself Using Your Mind-Body Connection with Healing Meditation – Jennifer Brooks

What if you discovered a form of healing that even hinted at relieving some of your toughest physical, emotional and even mental issues? What if this amazing form of healing cost you nothing and didn’t create any adverse, complicating side effects? Would you be interested? (By the way, it costs absolutely nothing)
It’s called healing meditation, and doctors nationwide are embracing this practice as part of the larger movement of integrative therapy. Integrative medicine does more than provide patients with the conventional medical treatments to help “cure” the disease. While it will never totally replace your visits to your doctor, it can help reduce your dependence on some prescription medications.

Healing meditations – and they come in many forms – have an amazing effect on quieting your mind and your body. Because of this, they can help reduce the effects on your body and mind. More and more, stress has been cited as a major contributor to a host of diseases, disorders and illnesses including cardiovascular disease, cancer, any pain associated with disorders and much more. Healing meditation has also been recommended as an effective approach to anger management.
If you’ve been battling a disorder and you’re feeling as if the traditional therapies aren’t as effective as you had hoped – or your healthcare provider has promised – it's time to complement those therapies with healing meditation. It just may change your life for the better.




Related Books You Will Enjoy:

How to Quiet Your Mind: Relax and Silence the Voice of Your Mind, Today! - A Beginner's Guide - Marc Allen
Is an inner dialog always going on inside you, preventing you from getting things done, making clear decisions, and concentrating on tasks? How many times have you been faced with some task or resolved to learn some new creative skill only to set it aside for some menial activity with no deadline or value? At the end of the day, have you ever asked yourself, “Why did I do that? Why did I waste so much time?” Are you looking to stop this?
In this book, you will learn about techniques to quiet this inner voice, relax, focus on the here and now, and get your mind to cooperate with what YOU want. You’ll learn very, very easy techniques that you can use starting today to quiet your inner dialogue and allow you to relieve stress and increase focus, techniques that can improve your intellectual and creative capacities, exercises that will help you in every aspect of your outward life, and more.
You’ll marvel at the simple yet powerful techniques contained within How to Quiet Your Mind: Relax and Silence the Voice of Your Mind, Today! Click here download this immediately from Google Play!

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I hope someone finds a read and or some insight in all of that.

I left the Law of Attraction BS out as I find that's rather toxic stuff. People tend to just want a quick fix and it just seems to feed the ego and quite rather the opposite of what meditation is all about. [There are snippets of wisdom to be sure in such a highly marketed concept - BUT - you really have to be in a good place to sift those out and make them stick] I acknowledge that perhaps some of my own experiences (the traumatic ones and a life of homelessness) has perhaps blinded me to seemingly perpetual need and over marketing of "success." But like I say ... $$$ and status are not what's important for me ... if it is for you ... then there are like billions of books from which to choose. They are certainly not for me and something I wish not to share. In fact, I apologize if I let any of that slip in with the above text. It's something I am always intending to filter out, whilst at the same time not react so much to the toxicity I find it to be. Perhaps in time my views on that may change ... Sohemehow I think it will be in the same direction it currently is; if it does.
Now I get on with me day. All this meditating seems to have be once again with a capacity to take more in.

Adios ... until next post.

[Ponder]

I'm no doubt showing my age with this post. Today I had a relaxing day. The highlight for me was YouTubing Doctor Smith from the original series; Lost In Space. It made Prime Time TV in Australia for Twenty Years! It aired before the original Star Trek series. Dr smith played a villain role but was adored by many kids. Me being one of them. He scared the shit out us, but did a good job of endearing himself. I especially loved how he and the Robot got along:


http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/happy/rolling-on-the-floor-laughing-smiley-emoticon.gif

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfh-YY465HA


Cool Link on the Space Craft - Jupiter 2:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SR_TBlE0Bho


Jonathan Harris (Dr Smith) on Biography/Tribute
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6kMNqQ-o5k

'Never Fear - Smith is Here'

That about sums up my day. ;)

[jessed03]

I just watched The Trap of Seeking. Watts' laugh gets me every time lol. It seems to have this bizarre power to instantly show you how nuts society and human beings can be.

Have you ever heard of Mooji? He's another guy I used to watch a lot of on Youtube. I think he was the first person who made me see that thoughts and feelings weren't gospel. That they were only ideas. I know Marc was a big fan too.

At the time, that revelation was mind-blowing to me.

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/tim-and-eric-mind-blown.gif

[jessed03]

P.s. Yeah, you are showing your age a bit with Lost in Space. This is the first time I've ever heard of it. ;)

[Ponder]

Love the Gif!!! Yea - I know what you mean. :) I listen to an hour long one whilst drifting on in bed last night. I must go find it now as there was some eyeopeners in that one as well. → The Guide to Beating Insecurity -Allan Watts. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqMCKUyfO8A) (Explores the Philosophy of illusion with two questions in mind. 1 - Whether to take life seriously or not / [Plot comic or tragic & if tragic is it ultimately tragic?] 2 - Who Are You? / PS - I am just as much a distraction to be sure (often to myself which is why I often require more space than I can find) - if ever I am to be found sitting in a crowd/group {extremely doubtful} wanting to emit in whatever way. We are all part of the chatter I guess and all wanting the same thing - Peace of mind.
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OK ... that wraps that up quite nicely ... I now have something else to share that you may or may not like. I think the download has just come in. I will have a break then make my next post before giving that a watch.

BRB ; )

[Ponder]

I'm kind of hoping you have not already seen this, however if you're not into the Sci-Fi genre I can understand why it may not be your thing. To borrow a word from mooji - The following film "defines" what Sci-fi was meant to be.


A quick 15 minute part one doco on the film which wraps up quite well just how amazing that film was to me:

As well as special effects being way ahead for that time - The Soundscapes are truly Amazing!!! The birth of digital synthesizing and used to excellent effect. Check out part two of the doco for more info on that:
Just like Dr Smith from Lost in Space use to scare the crap out of me - The sound of the monster approaching in this film left me with nightmares as a kid. :) No music credits were given because the entire sound in the film was completely synthesized. I think it's the only film to of ever done or is still to this today considered extremely rare.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BD_Ns-GcnnI#t=150.982869

Going to give part two a watch now then check out the HD rip I just sourced. Not hard to find. It really was eons ahead of its time. Some interesting philosophy(cold war period) in it as well not to mention that laughable stupidity factor of the human race.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/517/31668829805_9a40cd9b93_o.png

[Ponder]

I find it fascinating that the above film begins with a dialogue that states "The Lord sure does make beautiful planets" and then finishes with the words → "We're not all God." That is to say fascinating when you consider the message of Alan Watts and many others like him + our recent discussion. I find it quite hopeful to see just how far we have really come in the last 60 Years (since the making of of this film) with respect to seeing religion slowly losing its grip. We have since discovered that; every single one of us, is indeed -


God!

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/351/31558617981_de50886379_o.gif

:)

[Ponder]

YEA - "The Book" by Alen Watts is Awesome! Half way through it now and will not doubt be repeating it. TTS makes it so much easier to take in. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/toilet/reading-on-toilet.gif

Love the part how he relates society being the rest of our anatomy whilst we aim to separate ourselves whilst disregarding the effect that comes from self isolation. We soon get sick! It's very indepth and not so simple ... but I am loving it! I see if I can find that passage later on for my own benefit as I am always bitching over society and hearing it like that kind of really motivates me to cross that bridge and move on.

[Ponder]

In the meantime - It only makes sense to keep on open mind with the following. Who knows, perhaps Alan Watts is just part of some plot. Muahahaharrrr ...
I think they are already here D ... http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/hand-gestures/crossing-oneself-christian-smiley-emoticon.gif



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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxZhNVbgEQc

Night Night. ;)

http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/everyday/watching-horror-movie-smiley-emoticon.gif



'If only.'

[Ponder]

Wow!!! That actually put a LOT of concepts into perspective for me. Best up to date doco on an array of subjects I have been following for quite some time. I'll continue to explore this God Experience scenario, however still not subscribing to any rigid beliefs. This presentation only confirmed my current veiws re religion, secularism and new age self centred cults. Very glad I watched this despite staying up well past my routine sleep. Regardless of my own resistance to fob off the drama this really did sum everything that I have been seeing/sensing for a long time in a most refreshing way.

Excellent Watch!!!

[Ponder]

It's getting close to that time again D - If only I could find a place that is more me -- SIGH: Perhaps a padded room?

Very interesting to say the least. I've always been told this is nothing more than the addiction to stories and drama, however can't help but feel the information here is rather up to date with most of the "stories" that abound and goes a long way to ironing most of them out. Despite knowing first hand the negative effectives of religion and secularism and also being repelled at most new age self centered cults - I'm having trouble finding forums on this topic that are also not so club/fad & fear orientated.

Right now I am still very much exploring various philosophies that tend towards the "God Existence/in and through us" Concepts with people like Alan Watts and Eckhart Tolle. I neither adopt or reject these concepts/theories/suggestions & or views. I have to say after having and still exploring thoroughly many of the "Hierarchy / Alien Stories" ... I thought this presentation was yet another with it's own agenda more aimed for entertaining and feeding the frenzy. I am pleased to say that I am genuinely impressed with the way most of that drama was stitched together in this yet another ... Youtube documentary .

Can anyone recommend links to something not so pop cultured - hyped up - marketing orientated. Where I can further explore many of the claims being made in this presentation? Not more stories based on other stories that sound nothing more like myths and have no context to how we are currently being controlled. The latter I find more interesting rather than hearsay on star systems far far away.

I'd especially like to get more information/insights that more relates to the ending of this presentation where it rounds of by encouraging us all to yet still seek a form of spiritual evolution despite having just been warned against all forms/concepts of it that currently abound? This last part of my response is probably the most important to me, as I like many others in my confusion (in these no doubt confusing times) struggle with a strong form of resistance that comes when feeling so close to the truth - Whatever that be. Basically I strongly yearn for more information that relates on continued spiritual seeking without being sucked into all the "hype" the abounds. I've listened to enough paranormal, spooky hunter and conspiracy theory podcasts and more looking for other likeminded people whose agenda is not cult like.

Forgive me as I mean not to take the joy out of such things for others who cling to these things. It's totally understandable and I think to some extent even part of the distraction that's been touched on in this presentation and others like it. I guess - each presentation takes something from the other. That is to say a cross between The Zeitgeist Series, Obey, Gaia, Expanded Consciousness and then of course to wrap it all up "Beware of The Aliens" - WOW - That's a LOT to take in - especially when you consider this information age that many of us now live in. For many of us we have gone from pencils to mechanical typewriters and now to high speed digital down loading. We truly have exceeded our ability to digest.

Anyways - Now that I have a much grip (although still left with a million questions and not adopting any beliefs or at the very least leaving my perception very much open to change) - I'm really hoping someone out there can connect with anything that I have said and can point me into some kind of direction. Any forum suggests? I'm in a mental health one at the moment which should not be surprising.

The more I talk about this kind of thing, the more I alienate myself. It's hard to draw a line between seeking the truth and not losing one's mind to the mass of conspiracy and marekted theories ... How to keeping seeking without creating one's own hell? The later needs more exploration as kind of a double bind when once is advised to remain open to the truth no matter how black and white - yet struggles with the way we have been brainwashed in seeking comfort through running from the truth (typically a quick fix this day and age) yadda yadda ... That's the kind of continued dialogue I would love to have ... but in context with everything that's been delivered here without the tin foil hats.

I'm not srry for the long reply ... I hope it finds someone in tune and of like mind. Feel free to hook up and or direct me beyond this crossing of paths.Excellent presentation of the topic of aliens. Put a lot of things into perspective for me ... but I still require a lot more direction and would be greatful if I could connect with others someone lost; like myself .
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Rabbit hole now ensues.

[jessed03]

I just caught that alien doco.

For a long time, I've felt there was a lot of social engineering going on. It's like there's been a war on everything that has typically kept human beings grounded over the years: the nation state, religion, the family unit, masculinity, and self-sustainability. Given that I'm not particularly patriotic or religious, I didn't care about the changes very much.

I figured it was for globalisation reasons, to create a global workforce working for pennies but consuming by the bucketload. Or I figured it was for social reasons, to merge everybody together to stop wars (see Coudenhove-Kalergi, who sponsored an award given to Angela Merkel a few years ago).

The possibility of invaders certainly adds a new, more sinister dimension to things, though!

[jessed03]

Here's an interesting video on free will. The more I read up on it, the more I think it is actually an illusion.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRIcbsRXQ0o

[Dahila]

Boys just calm down :)) let me to make some white tea for you :)

[Ponder]

LOL D - I think J and I have a good handle on it. Jesse I am just passing through and will for sure check out later. I was only just saying to D today how the family unit is overrated and actually plays into the deception. I look forward to watching your link on Free Will. Back later.

:( Video Unavailable? I search the Title. Perhaps you could try another link for us? Please & TY.

[Ponder]

I found quite a few vids ... some long - some short ... is this the particular one you were linking? It was the closest I could match with the thumbnail image used in your above link. Sadly the link is still broken for me??
Sam Harris o wolnej woli - polskie napisy - Free Will with Sam Harris (https:/www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhfMWbNuND4)

[Ponder]

I can see both sides of the augment.


Point ONE - I acknowledge how a steady stream of neurophysiologic influences can trigger one’s predispositions/genes. One’s environmental and experiential history and as too current circumstances, can for sure play a greater role in moulding us into who we be from one moment to the next regardless of how much we believe we can take control solely by the way we think.


Point TWO – I also know first-hand the power of the mind. Especially as someone who’s already been through hell and is brave enough to see the world as it is. The only reason I am still here is because of the power of my mind. However the ability to use intuition and create something from nothing despite extenuating circumstances whilst liberating is still heavily influenced by one's experiences. (largely dictated by point number one)

In Alan Watt's Book - "The Book" - I think he refers to this kind of thing as a double bind.

I prefer to not use terms like “better” “strive” and “success” because they are words that now play largely into that uncontrollable stream of neurophysiologic influences! That’s another story. I’ll just quote John Kabat Zin here → “Meditation is the only intentional, systematic human activity which at bottom is about not trying to improve yourself or get anywhere else, but simply to realize where you already are.” ― Jon Kabat-Zinn, Wherever You Go, There You Are I revert to the practice of doing nothing, not because of giving into an argument on determination; but more as a practical tool to live rather than fight.

Anything else just ends up in a tail spin. I think Sam's talk on Free Will here is more for people still crying over spilt milk. I won't say spiritually immature because that alien documentary hit home on how many new agers peg people down with that kind of crap. People who cry need to cry ... eventually with enough time, one will see and make a choice regardless of how limiting one's options may seem. The more one grows the more options one will see. What works for one may not be for me, vis versa and yet whilst on different paths; we may both still end up finding peace.

There are two sides of the equation with free will that Sam is explaining here and I think he does it well. I just don't gel with the clinical self help lingo towards the end, however will swap out most of those terms to his single phrase ... Pep Talk. A pep talk for me often winds up in affirmations that deal with the subconscious on a number of levels as too a number of methods. The more I am open to both sides of the augments ... (without really stepping into the ring) ... the more I see how things really work on both side of the fence - thus - more times than not I end up escaping the maze and writing my own books! Trouble is, if I do not keep mindful - more mazes pop up.

I don't sell books nor propose to be an author that writes his destiny and then entitles his works with cheesy words; like - "The Secret."

To keep things in context within this thread and the few last posts ... Indeed - We should acknowledge just how powerful and controlling genetics and our environment really is! Today's World relies heaving on such factors and well placed to dominate as it does. However never be discouraged by the limited number of choices when it comes to more people living, dwindling resources, more rules and regulations and less number of places. Those neurophysiologic influences will in all likelihood see a great deal of us cross boundaries that science and philosophers never thought we could.

[jessed03]

Hehe, D. I'll take a tea. ;)

Did you manage to find a new doctor?

[Ponder]

??? Srry Jesse. Not quite sure what you mean? I am still waking up.

Black or White? Nothing like a philosophical cup. :)

[Dahila]

thanks Jesse one black coming up and white tea for mr Ponder, I am waiting for interview with one, and waiting for call from another one:) I am drinking cappuccino right now, Just came back from Market; shitty day, very slow, roads covered by ice, not fun at all today. :) but I am here and happy I am home

[jessed03]

Hey Dave, sorry, my reply was to Dahila. I didn't get the chance to have a proper read through yours yet. Been rushing around today. Head is also really foggy too, unfortunately.

D, thanks for the tea lol. Sucks you weren't so successful at the market. I think today is a really popular day for spending money, too. What's your schedule like in the run up to Christmas? Do you have any more markets to go to?

[Dahila]

Jesse I am renting the booth there, so I am on Market every Saturday, one more Saturday on xmas eve. Today roads were so dangerous that not many people came

[Ponder]

My Bad - D often calls D. All in good time. No response is also good :)

I'm pleased your doing well D. I have not had coffee in a long time. Just on the way back from the city with my son and his girlfriend. Looking forward to a cup of coffee soon enough. :)

[Dahila]

yeah we call each other D. hehehe and I offered for DAve, white tea, forget about coffee, My grandchild is dancing today in great theatre and we are going to see it. Two performance a day , they started yesterday, we my partner and I are going today. It is still snowing but even if I have to go the ten click on my feet I will :))

[Ponder]

I hope you had a blast attending your grand daughters dance D. I miss winter ... we barely see much of it since having move up here now. I hope all is well. From all that you have told me, I must say that your granddaughter is exceptionally talented. She must really warm your heart like nothing else in this world.

[Ponder]

I feel the need to share the following. From where I am now at and to all that I have been seeking ... this part of Alan Watts "The Book" although only half a chapter spoke volumes. First I share it ... then later contemplate it. For me it really hit's the nail on the head with regard to all facets of this life.
____________________________________

The Book - Alan Watts

There are Six Parts to this Book:



INSIDE INFORMATION
THE GAME OF BLACK-AND-WHITE
HOW TO BE A GENUINE FAKE
THE WORLD IS YOUR BODY
SO WHAT?
Six IT


I'm sharing part of 5 - SO WHAT?

"To have spoken of a new vision is to be asked, in the next breath, what good it will do. When you come to think of it, this is astonishing, but it is invariably true in speaking with people brought up in the environment of Protestantism. Catholics, Hindus, Buddhists, Moslems, and Taoists understand that vision, or contemplation, is good in itself, even the supreme good in the sense of the Beatific Vision where all beings are eternally absorbed in the knowledge and love of God. But this possibility makes Protestants nervous, and one of their official prayers asks that those in heaven may be granted “continual growth in thy love and service,” because, after all, you can’t stop Progress. Even heaven must be a growing community.


The reason is, I suppose, that modern Protestantism in particular, in its liberal and progressive forms, is the religion most strongly influenced by the mythology of the world of objects, and of man as the separate ego. Man so defined and so experienced is, of course, incapable of pleasure and contentment, let alone creative power. Hoaxed into the illusion of being an independent, responsible source of actions, he cannot understand why what he does never comes up to what he should do, for a society which has defined him as separate cannot persuade him to behave as if he really belonged. Thus he feels chronic guilt and makes the most heroic efforts to placate his conscience.


From these efforts come social services, hospitals, peace movements, foreign-aid programs, free education, and the whole philosophy of the welfare state. Yet we are bedeviled by the fact that the more these heroic and admirable enterprises succeed, the more they provoke new and increasingly horrendous problems. For one thing, few of us have ever thought through the problem of what good such enterprises are ultimately supposed to achieve. When we have fed the hungry, clothed the naked, and housed the homeless, what then? Is the object to enable unfortunate people to help those still more unfortunate? To convert Hindus and Africans into a huge bourgeoisie, where every Bengali and every Zulu has the privilege of joining our special rat-race, buying appliances on time and a television set to keep him running?


Some years ago a friend of mine was walking through tea plantations near Darjeeling, and noticed one particular group of fields where the bushes were all shriveled. On asking why, it was explained that the owner had felt so sorry for his impoverished workers that he had paid them double. But as a result, they had turned up for work only half the time, which was disastrous in the critical season when the plants have to be tended every day. My friend put this problem to an Indian communist. His solution was to pay them double and compel them to work. He then put it to an American businessman. His solution was to pay them double—and put radios in their homes! No one seemed to understand that those workers valued time for goofing off more than money.


It is hard for compulsive activists to see that the vast social and economic problems of the world cannot be settled by mere effort and technique. The outsider cannot just barge in like Santa Claus and put things to right—especially our kind of outsider who, because he has no sense of belonging in the world, invariably smells like an interferer. He does not really know what he wants, and therefore everyone suspects that there are limitless strings attached to his gifts. For if you know what you want, and will be content with it, you can be trusted. But if you do not know, your desires are limitless and no one can tell how to deal with you. Nothing satisfies an individual incapable of enjoyment. I am not saying that American and European corporations are run by greedy villains who live off the fat of the land at everyone else’s expense. The point becomes clear only as one realizes, with compassion and sorrow, that many of our most powerful and wealthy men are miserable dupes and captives in a treadmill, who—with the rarest exceptions—have not the ghost of a notion how to spend and enjoy money.


If I had been a Heathen,


I’d have praised the purple vine,


My slaves would dig the vineyards,


And I would drink the wine;


But Higgins is a Heathen,


And his slaves grow lean and grey,


That he may drink some tepid milk


Exactly twice a day.1


The startling truth is that our best efforts for civil rights, international peace, population control, conservation of natural resources, and assistance to the starving of the earth—urgent as they are—will destroy rather than help if made in the present spirit. For, as things stand, we have nothing to give. If our own riches and our own way of life are not enjoyed here, they will not be enjoyed anywhere else. Certainly they will supply the immediate jolt of energy and hope that methedrine, and similar drugs, give in extreme fatigue. But peace can be made only by those who are peaceful, and love can be shown only by those who love. No work of love will flourish out of guilt, fear, or hollowness of heart, just as no valid plans for the future can be made by those who have no capacity for living now.


The separate person is without content, in both senses of the word. He lives perpetually on hope, on looking forward to tomorrow, having been brought up this way from childhood, when his uncomprehending rage at double-binds was propitiated with toys. If you want to find a true folk-religion in our culture, look at the rites of Santa Claus. Even before the beginning of Advent, which was supposed to be a three-to-four week fasting period in preparation for the feast, the streets are decorated for Christmas, the shops glitter with tinsel and festive displays of gifts, and public-address systems warble electronic carols so that one is sick to death of Venite adoremus long before Christmas Day. Trees are already baubled and illumined in most homes, and as the big buildup proceeds they are surrounded by those shiny packages with shimmering ribbons which look as if they held gifts for princes. By this time Christmas parties have already been held in schools and offices before closing for the actual holiday, so that by Christmas Eve the celebrations have just about blown their top. But there are still those packages under the tree and stockings by the fireplace.


When at last the Day comes the children are frantic. Hardly able to wait for breakfast, and not having slept most of the night, they tear those gold and silver parcels to shreds as if they contained nothing less than the Elixir of Life or the Philosopher’s Stone. By noon the living-room looks as if a waste-paper truck had crashed into a dimestore, leaving a wreck of mangled cartons, excelsior, wrapping-paper, and writhing ribbons; neckties, up-ended dolls, half-assembled model railroads, spacesuits, plastic atom-bombs, and scattered chocolate bars; hundreds of tinker-toy pieces, crushed tree ornaments, miniature sports-cars, water-pistols, bottles of whisky, and balloons. An hour later the children are blubbering or screaming, and have to be shooed out-of-doors while the mess is shoved together to make room for Christmas dinner. Thereafter, the Twelve Days of Christmas are spent with upset stomachs, colds, and influenza, and on New Year’s Eve the adults get stoned to forget the whole thing.


Well, it was fun describing it, but the point is that intense expectation fizzled. The girl was gorgeous but the guy was impotent. But since there must be something somewhere, expectation is kindled again to keep us all going for that golden, galuptious goodie at the end of the line. What could it be? The children knew it well until they got caught in the rat-race. One of the best Christmas presents I ever had was a cheap ring with a glass diamond. It was quite incidental—something that came out of a snapper (or cracker) at a party. But I sat down in front of the fireplace with this enchanted object, and turned it to catch the different colors of light which blazed inside it. I knew that I had found the Ring of Solomon, with which he summoned djinns and afrits with wings of brass—and it wasn’t that I wanted them to do anything for me, for it was just enough to be in that atmosphere, to watch these magical beings come to life in the flames of the fire, and to feel that I was in touch with the timeless paradise-world."

The Book - Alan Watts ( Ch 5 So What?)

[Ponder]

The Book - Alan Watts ( Ch 5 So What?)

"Now it is symptomatic of our rusty-beer-can type of sanity that our culture produces very few magical objects. Jewelry is slick and uninteresting. Architecture is almost totally bereft of exuberance, obsessed with erecting glass boxes. Children’s books are written by serious ladies with three names and no imagination, and as for comics, have you ever looked at the furniture in Dagwood’s home? The potentially magical ceremonies of the Catholic Church are either gabbled away at top speed, or rationalized with the aid of a commentator. Drama or ritual in everyday behavior is considered affectation and bad form, and manners have become indistinguishable from mannerisms—where they exist at all. We produce nothing comparable to the great Oriental carpets, Persian glass, tiles, and illuminated books, Arabian leatherwork, Spanish marquetry, Hindu textiles, Chinese porcelain and embroidery, Japanese lacquer and brocade, French tapestries, or Inca jewelry. (Though, incidentally, there are certain rather small electronic devices that come unwittingly close to fine jewels.)

The reason is not just that we are too much in a hurry and have no sense of the present; not just that we cannot afford the type of labor that such things would now involve, nor just that we prefer money to materials. The reason is that we have scrubbed the world clean of magic. We have lost even the vision of paradise, so that our artists and craftsmen can no longer discern its forms. This is the price that must be paid for attempting to control the world from the standpoint of an “I” for whom everything that can be experienced is a foreign object and a nothing-but.


It would be sentimental and impossible to go back. Children are in touch with paradise to the extent that they have not fully learned the ego-trick, and the same is true of cultures which, by our standards, are more “primitive” and—by analogy—childlike. If, then, after understanding, at least in theory, that the ego-trick is a hoax and that, beneath everything, “I” and “universe” are one, you ask, “So what? What is the next step, the practical application?”—I will answer that the absolutely vital thing is to consolidate your understanding, to become capable of enjoyment, of living in the present, and of the discipline which this involves. Without this you have nothing to give—to the cause of peace or of racial integration, to starving Hindus and Chinese, or even to your closest friends. Without this, all social concern will be muddlesome meddling, and all work for the future will be planned disaster.


But the way is not back. Just as science overcame its purely atomistic and mechanical view of the world through more science, the ego-trick must be overcome through intensified self-consciousness. For there is no way of getting rid of the feeling of separateness by a so-called “act of will,” by trying to forget yourself, or by getting absorbed in some other interest. This is why moralistic preaching is such a failure: it breeds only cunning hypocrites—people sermonized into shame, guilt, or fear, who thereupon force themselves to behave as if they actually loved others, so that their “virtues” are often more destructive, and arouse more resentment, than their “vices.” A British social service project, run by earnest and rather formidable ladies, called the Charity Organization Society—C.O.S. for short—used to be known among the poor as “Cringe or Starve.”


The Taoist philosopher Chuang-tzu described such efforts to be ego-less as “beating a drum in search of a fugitive,” or, as we would put it, driving to a police raid with sirens on. Or, as the Hindus say, it is like trying not to think of a monkey while taking medicine, on the basis of the popular superstition that thinking of a monkey will make the medicine ineffective. All that such efforts can teach us is that they do not work, for the more we try to behave without greed or fear, the more we realize that we are doing this for greedy or fearful reasons. Saints have always declared themselves as abject sinners—through recognition that their aspiration to be saintly is motivated by the worst of all sins, spiritual pride, the desire to admire oneself as a supreme success in the art of love and unselfishness. And beneath this lies a bottomless pit of vicious circles: the game, “I am more penitent that you” or “My pride in my humility is worse than yours.” Is there any way not to be involved in some kind of one-upmanship? “I am less of a one-upman than you.” “I am a worse one-upman than you.” “I realize more clearly than you that everything we do is one-upmanship.” The ego-trick seems to reaffirm itself endlessly in posture after posture.


But as I pursue these games—as I become more conscious of being conscious, more aware that I am unable to define myself as being up without you (or something other than myself) being down—I see vividly that I depend on your being down for my being up. I would never be able to know that I belong to the in-group of “nice” or “saved” people without the assistance of an out-group of “nasty” or “damned” people. How can any in-group maintain its collective ego without relishing dinner-table discussions about the ghastly conduct of outsiders? The very identity of racist Southerners depends upon contrasting themselves with those dirty black “nigras.” But, conversely, the out-groups feel that they are really and truly “in,” and nourish their collective ego with relishingly indignant conversation about squares, Ofays, Wasps, Philistines, and the blasted bourgeoisie. Even Saint Thomas Aquinas let it out that part of the blessedness of the saints in Heaven was that they could look over the battlements and enjoy the “proper justice” of the sinners squirming in Hell. All winners need losers; all saints need sinners; all sages need fools—that is, so long as the major kick in life is to “amount to something” or to “be someone” as a particular and separate godlet.


But I define myself in terms of you; I know myself only in terms of what is “other,” no matter whether I see the “other” as below me or above me in any ladder of values. If above, I enjoy the kick of self-pity; if below, I enjoy the kick of pride. I being I goeswith you being you. Thus, as a great Hassidic rabbi put it, “If I am I because you are you, and if you are you because I am I, then I am not I, and you are not you.” Instead we are both something in common between what Martin Buber has called I-and-Thou and I-and-It—the magnet itself which lies between the poles, between I myself and everything sensed as other.


There it is, a theoretically undeniable fact. But the question is how to get over the sensation of being locked out from everything “other,” of being only oneself—an organism flung into unavoidable competition and conflict with almost every “object” in its experience. There are innumerable recipes for this project, almost all of which have something to recommend them. There are the practices of yoga meditation, dervish dancing, psychotherapy, Zen Buddhism, Ignatian, Salesian, and Hesychast methods of “prayer,” the use of consciousness-changing chemicals such as LSD and mescaline, psychodrama, group dynamics, sensory-awareness techniques, Quakerism, Gurdjieff exercises, relaxation therapies, the Alexander method, autogenic training, and self-hypnosis. The difficulty with every one of these disciplines is that the moment you are seriously involved, you find yourself boxed in some special in-group which defines itself, often with the most elegant subtlety, by the exclusion of an out-group. In this way, every religion or cult is self-defeating, and this is equally true of projects which define themselves as non-religions or universally inclusive religions, playing the game of “I am less exclusive than you.”


It is thus that religions and non-religions—all established in the name of brotherhood and universal love—are invariably divisive and quarrelsome. What, for example, is more quarrelsome—in practical politics—than the project for a truly classless and democratic society? Yet the historical origin of this movement is mystical. It goes back to Jesus and Saint Paul, to Eckhart and Tauler, to the Anabaptists, Levelers, and Brothers of the Free Spirit, and their insistence that all men are equal in the sight of God. It seems almost as if to be is to quarrel, or at least to differ, to be in contrast with something else. If so, whoever does not put up a fight has no identity; whoever is not selfish has no self. Nothing unites a community so much as common cause against an external enemy, yet, in the same moment, that enemy becomes the essential support of social unity. Therefore larger societies require larger enemies, bringing us in due course to the perilous point of our present situation, where the world is virtually divided into two huge camps. But if high officers on both sides have any intelligence at all, they make a secret agreement to contain the conflict: to call each other the worst names, but to refrain from dropping bombs. Or, if they insist that there must be some fighting to keep armies in trim, they restrict it to local conflicts in “unimportant” countries. Voltaire should have said that if the Devil did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him."

The Book - Alan Watts ( Ch 5 So What?)

[Ponder]

The Book - Alan Watts (ch 5 - So What?)

Nevertheless, the more it becomes clear that to be is to quarrel and to pursue self-interest, the more you are compelled to recognize your need for enemies to support you. In the same way, the more resolutely you plumb the question “Who or what am I?”—the more unavoidable is the realization that you are nothing at all apart from everything else. Yet again, the more you strive for some kind of perfection or mastery—in morals, in art, or in spirituality—the more you see that you are playing a rarified and lofty form of the old ego-game, and that your attainment of any height is apparent to yourself and to others only by contrast with someone else’s depth or failure.


This understanding is at first paralyzing. You are in a trap—in the worst of all double-binds—seeing that any direction you may take will imply, and so evoke, its opposite. Decide to be a Christ, and there will be a Judas to betray you and a mob to crucify you. Decide to be a devil, and men will unite against you in the closest brotherly love. Your first reaction may be simply, “To hell with it!” The only course may seem to be to forget the whole effort and become absorbed in trivialities, or to check out of the game by suicide or psychosis, and spend the rest of your days blabbering in an asylum.


But there is another possibility. Instead of checking out, let us ask what the trap means. What is implied in finding yourself paralyzed, unable to escape from a game in which all the rules are double-binds and all moves self-defeating? Surely this is a deep and intense experience of the same double-bind that was placed upon you in infancy, when the community told you that you must be free, responsible, and loving, and when you were helplessly defined as an independent agent. The sense of paralysis is therefore the dawning realization that this is nonsense and that your independent ego is a fiction. It simply isn’t there, either to do anything or to be pushed around by external forces, to change things or to submit to change. The sense of “I,” which should have been identified with the whole universe of your experience, was instead cut off and isolated as a detached observer of that universe. In the preceding chapter we saw that this unity of organism and environment is a physical fact. But when you know for sure that your separate ego is a fiction, you actually feel yourself AS the whole process and pattern of life. Experience and experiencer become one experiencing, known and knower one knowing.


Each organism experiences this from a different standpoint and in a different way, for each organism is the universe experiencing itself in endless variety. One need not, then, fall into the trap which this experience holds for believers in an external, all-powerful God—the temptation to feel “I am God” in that sense, and to expect to be worshipped and obeyed by all other organisms.


Remember, above all, that an experience of this kind cannot be forced or made to happen by any act of your fictitious “will,” except insofar as repeated efforts to be one-up on the universe may eventually reveal their futility. Don’t try to get rid of the ego-sensation. Take it, so long as it lasts, as a feature or play of the total process—like a cloud or wave, or like feeling warm or cold, or anything else that happens of itself. Getting rid of one’s ego is the last resort of invincible egoism! It simply confirms and strengthens the reality of the feeling. But when this feeling of separateness is approached and accepted like any other sensation, it evaporates like the mirage that it is.


This is why I am not overly enthusiastic about the various “spiritual exercises” in meditation or yoga which some consider essential for release from the ego. For when practiced in order to “get” some kind of spiritual illumination or awakening, they strengthen the fallacy that the ego can toss itself away by a tug at its own bootstraps. But there is nothing wrong with meditating just to meditate, in the same way that you listen to music just for the music. If you go to concerts to “get culture” or to improve your mind, you will sit there as deaf as a doorpost.


If, then, you ask me how to get beyond the ego-feeling, I shall ask you why you want to get there. If you give me the honest answer, which is that your ego will feel better in the “higher spiritual status” of self-transcendence, you will thus realize that you—as ego—are a fake. You will feel like an onion: skin after skin, subterfuge after subterfuge, is pulled off to find no kernel at the center. Which is the whole point: to find out that the ego is indeed a fake—a wall of defense around a wall of defense … around nothing. You can’t even want to get rid of it, nor yet want to want to.


Understanding this, you will see that the ego is exactly what it pretends it isn’t. Far from being the free center of personality, it is an automatic mechanism implanted since childhood by social authority, with—perhaps—a touch of heredity thrown in. This may give you the temporary feeling of being a zombie or a puppet dancing irresponsibly on strings that lead away to unknown forces. At this point, the ego may reassert itself with the insidious “I-can’t-help-myself” play in which the ego splits itself in two and pretends that it is its own victim. “See, I’m only a bundle of conditioned reflexes, so you mustn’t get angry with me for acting just as I feel.” (To which the answer could be, “Well, we’re just zombies too, so you shouldn’t complain if we get angry.”)


But who is it that mustn’t get angry or shouldn’t complain, as if there were still some choice in the matter? The ego is still surviving as the “I” which must passively endure the automatic behavior of “myself” and others—again, as if there were some choice which the witnessing self can make between putting up with things and attacking them violently. What has happened is that the frustrated ego has withdrawn into its last stronghold of independence, retaining its identity as a mere watcher, or sufferer, of all that goes on. Here it pities itself or consoles itself as a puppet of fate.


But if this is seen as yet another subterfuge, we are close to the final showdown. A line of separation is now drawn between everything that happens to me, including my own feelings, on the one side, and on the other, I myself as the conscious witness. Isn’t it easy to see that this line is imaginary, and that it, and the witness behind it, are the same old faking process automatically learned in childhood? The same old cleft between the knower and the known? The same old split between the organism/environment and the organism’s feedback, or self-conscious mechanism? If, then, there is no choice in what happens to me, on one side of the line, there is equally no choice on the other, on the witnessing side, as to whether I should accept what happens or reject it. I accept, I reject, I witness just as automatically as things happen or as my emotions reflect my physiological chemistry.

The Book - Alan Watts (ch 5 - So What?)

[Ponder]

The Book - Alan Watts (Ch 5 - So What?)

Yet in this moment when one seems about to become a really total zombie, the whole thing blows up. For there is no fate unless there is someone or something to be fated. There is no trap without someone to be caught. There is, indeed, no compulsion unless there is also freedom of choice, for the sensation of behaving involuntarily is known only by contrast with that of behaving voluntarily. Thus when the line between myself and what happens to me is dissolved and there is no stronghold left for an ego even as a passive witness, I find myself not in a world but as a world which is neither compulsive nor capricious. What happens is neither automatic nor arbitrary: it just happens, and all happenings are mutually interdependent in a way that seems unbelievably harmonious. Every this goes with every that. Without others there is no self, and without somewhere else there is no here, so that—in this sense—self is other and here is there.


When this new sensation of self arises, it is at once exhilarating and a little disconcerting. It is like the moment when you first got the knack of swimming or riding a bicycle. There is the feeling that you are not doing it yourself, but that it is somehow happening on its own, and you wonder whether you will lose it—as indeed you may if you try forcibly to hold on to it. In immediate contrast to the old feeling, there is indeed a certain passivity to the sensation, as if you were a leaf blown along by the wind, until you realize that you are both the leaf and the wind. The world outside your skin is just as much you as the world inside: they move together inseparably, and at first you feel a little out of control because the world outside is so much vaster than the world inside. Yet you soon discover that you are able to go ahead with ordinary activities—to work and make decisions as ever, though somehow this is less of a drag. Your body is no longer a corpse which the ego has to animate and lug around. There is a feeling of the ground holding you up, and of hills lifting you when you climb them. Air breathes itself in and out of your lungs, and instead of looking and listening, light and sound come to you on their own. Eyes see and ears hear as wind blows and water flows. All space becomes your mind. Time carries you along like a river, but never flows out of the present: the more it goes, the more it stays, and you no longer have to fight or kill it.”

The Book - Alan Watts (ch 5 - So What?)

[Ponder]

Now here's the thing. I've barely scratched the surface on all of that, yet there is SO much in it and it really does hit the nail on the head as to how I've already been thinking. It also explains well just how insanity can follow as a result from Watts's well express double bind scenarios.

The part on separatism in all it's forms from religion to state again hits the nail on the head which plays largely into how I feel so isolated when refusing to play the game yet being stuck in the void. That part really hits home for me ... yet whilst living in one, I still feel pretty much homeless and lonely.

Thankfully there were other parts in all that text that brought about an an air of hope and validation to being as is. In fact - I feel strongly about that.

My battery is about to go out as currently working all this during a blackout. So I might just post this for now. Just noting all this in my diary now as this is really profound stuff from where I am at. It's what I have been on about for ages ... for years. What I have been rambling on about, but been unable to get out.

Now you know where I am coming from and what I am going to continue on ... I'll be referring and linking that text as I now work through that part of the book.

So Jesse and D ... go on as you wish and or get involved ... but I will be using this space to sift through all of the above. To do more than unravel limiting belief systems such as the the church, the state and all other like wise double binds ... all those facets that have basically driven most of us to our wits end ... Moreover ... how to let go ... of all that crap yet not feel so alone.

Adios ... until next post.

[Dahila]

yes it was an excellent ballet performance the "nutcraker " composed by Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky. It was not broadway but it was a beautiful performance and seeing the small one, smiling and dancing ............eh my heart is singing

[Ponder]

Child's Play - It's not cynical, but more a fact ... a crushing blow to see the life being sucked out of them as they grow - within a system we know so well. We enjoy such fleeting moments while they last and guide them as best we can. It's all in the above text.


Very Cool!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8J8urC_8Jw

Awesome ... I am enjoying this very much ... TY : )

[Dahila]

this is the best https://youtu.be/xtLoaMfinbU
It is so incredible but russian are known for the best ballet. Watch at least a few minutes of that , unbelievable
I could not take my eys of the screen and I had seen russian ballet back home, I went to Russia like once every month

[Ponder]

Whilst I am very much a visual person D - I have to be honest and say when it comes to classical performances, it's more the sounds for me. However I have been moved and will emote accordingly. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/sad/crying-and-sniffling.gif

[Dahila]

D. art in every form is deeply influencing us. Beauty is a beauty. I love classical, I love Jazz, reggae, paintings, my favourite Modigliani, Utrillo, and many more ...........

[jessed03]

I just read through that Watts extract above. I can see why you're glad you bought the book. It goes deeper than the vids, doesn't it? Plus you have the option of re-reading parts.

The idea Watts is talking about is pantheism. Carl Sagan and Einstein were arguably pantheists. The philosopher Spinoza was perhaps the most famous from the West. If ever you want to hear different explanations of the views Watts talks about, there are quite a few communities online that discuss this. Plus other famous pantheists have written some popular books, many from different angles.

It makes a lot of sense to me, what he says. Makes you realize how crazy Christianity is, and how it's screwed up the West. For thousands of years we've been told we're the centre of the universe and were hand-crafted by this adoring God, who then give us control of the earth. We've raised generations to believe they're totally separate from something they're a part of and convinced them they'll one day rise above it all any way.

Watts' words are grounding.

My only criticism really is Watts' use of the word "God". I understand why he uses it. He was a spiritual teacher influenced by Hinduism. It's just that "God" is such a loaded term, one which we all have preconceived notions of (what does "God" even really mean?!). I think using the word "universe" makes more sense. The universe is something we're all aware of. There's no real need to swap a functional term for some vague notion of God. I'm happy to think of myself and others as fundamental expressions of the universe. Active parts of this mind-blowing process, much of which is still to be discovered. I don't think I need the idea of any kind of God in there to experience the wonder of that realization.

I look forward to reading more of your musings, Dave. Or should I say, I look forward to more of your musings happening. ;)

[Ponder]

I have to be honest D and say that my appreciation for mainstream art matches that which I hold for humanity and it's given state; especially when I consider that of this decaying planet. This is why my passion for photography and other arts, has considerably waned of late. Nonetheless regardless of my being unmoved for this time of year and what it brings; I am pleased with whatever happiness it presents for my friends.

Just going to take a moment to enjoy the art of making my oats and then the process of shoveling it in. LOL ... back to contemplate Jesse's reply then. :)

[jessed03]

Zen and the art of oat-making, eh!

Enjoy. I've just been bumming around today. Got an on-off nerve problem in my back that's acting up today for some reason. Hey-ho.

D, I hope the snow hasn't gobbled you up!

[Ponder]

Hope it irons itself out Jesse.

I just finished zenning with the food dehydrator. Made up 7 and a half trays of nuts and seeds ... should be ready in about 14 hours ... the seeds somewhat earlier.

Will relay after I have watched some more "American" Horror Stories on Netflix. You know ... I have to prioritise and all. ;)

Just off the bat ... I remember Richard Dawkins using the phrase pantheism (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantheism)quite a lot. Yea I know what you mean about using such a loaded term as God. It such a hang up term that whilst religion itself is seeing a reduction in sheep, the word itself is still rather conflicting and imo best left to the wind like most of it's former myths. Back a bit later ... hope your back feels a little better.

[Ponder]

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/289/31715662536_00723e8b80_o.jpg


https://c8.staticflickr.com/1/648/31753101535_7fdc725213_o.jpg

[Ponder]

Having the option to re-read. I’ve been both reading and using Text To Speech. For me his works and others like require me going over more than just a few times. For me it is the same as many likewise teaching on video as well.
I like how you link Carl Sagan and Einstein to being pantheists. That works well for me. I seem to sense that watts is leaving the door open with regard to pantheism in that the “concept” in itself it’s not absolute as well as the trap for those that think of themselves as being a pantheist. Like someone who attends a Buddhist Retreat thinking that doing so makes them a Buddhist … kind of thing. In this regard I also get sense that many people online discussing all these notions do so more to fit some kind of intellectual persona more than anything else. Just yet another ego trap of the mind I am sure. Then of course there are those like myself, whilst no doubt still stuck in their ego just plainly lost and fail to know enough lingo with which to adequately express and or communicate with such academics.


Towards the end of “The Book” Watt’s carefully addresses the different approaches and attitudes between and with white coats and metaphysics. I’ve been looking for a new online home for quite some time now and still yet falling short. The debating/auguring draws me into a gravity well that’s sees the scales tip towards negative when in forums with more academics than not, whilst many metaphysical bases forums can be overly dramatic and whimsical. This is just my view of course and if I had to choose, I feel I tend towards more the metaphysical and from the way I am reading Watts, I think he kind of is too. (I'll try to find those paragraphs a little later) He seems to indicate more growth in metaphysical terms and sums up the academic approaches to be found somewhat wanting.


Will post later on all how so many of these teachers still use the word GOD as I feel very similar on that point as you.


My Lunch needs tending and awaits.


Yes lol it’s just happening. : )

[Dahila]

https://youtu.be/C1fs19um8ZU...................

[Ponder]

I listened to it "all" the way through whilst playing on my computer. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/hand-gestures/hands-clapping-applause-smiley-emoticon.gif

[Ponder]

I found this one rather interesting Jesse. Seems to confirm my suspicion that Watts is not overly concerned with knowing it all and once again makes a point about the futility in trying to: I could be wrong - but that's how I am sensing it. I know john Kabat_Zinn is always on about ... "it's OK not to know!" "I don't know!" Why is it that more that these teachers profess to know nothing, they seem to know it all. lol ... and those that profess to know it all ... know nothing!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOo8CUThdqc

[Ponder]

Before I sign off for the day - This following Youtube link → 5 minutes - Think of Nothing (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQ5upMz0_ig) - (The volume will need adjusting but the animation is quite well done) I often feel a sense of peace when letting the feeling of nothing come over me. When letting go of all that crap we are taught to cling to - The Striving - The Wanting - and above all; the fear of what comes or does not come next. (not just death) In many dharma talks I have listened to whilst out walking, "Expanse" is a topic I have always liked.

It would seem to me that many people that want, like to justify the ego as some kind of need in order to give their life meaning. As someone that struggles with mental illness and to that I have seen in others who likewise struggle and are over the state of our current system (just seeing it for what it is) ... I know many others out there feel the same. There comes a point after having suffered/endured so many times that when we have nothing left to tireless drive us as has been - that the void is not as dark as it seems! It's NOT cynical or pessimistic whatsoever. It's actually quite beautiful when contrasting with one's state of being - no matter what that state may be! Of course the more one has, the less they see and the message in this goes unheard ... until such a time when confronted with one's worst fears.

PLease excuse me as I'm getting tired now ... although feeling relaxed as these vids are really helping me understand just how much I need to die to self before I meet my end. Moreover that one need not wait until such a time in order to really appreciate the void for what it is. To take loneliness and give it new meaning by refusing to believe the BS that's often preached!

I share this next and last vid for the day because it's just as insightful and beautiful when it comes to exposing the lies and revealing the cycle.

6 minutes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7KRgluYeps

There is nothing to be sad about when contemplating the void so many of us already find ourselves in. That's the context I ponder in as there is a doorway to the insights within these vids that we can learn to start living once again ... despite feeling as though we are already dead. I think that is rather hopeful, optimistic and dare I say positive thinking! I guarantee you those that response with terms such a cynical and pessimistic are themselve more challenged to hearing the truth as is.

Like Alan kind of says in the first link - Feel the Nothingness - Imagine it ... No more anything ... This is where to me the sensation of nothingness washing over me is blissful compared to all that BS notion of Jesus's Blood cleansing me. There is no price to pay whatsoever in the acceptance of nothing, however the former carries with it nothing but shame and guilt. Imagine no more grinding to be more than what one already is. No more grinding the mill! No more striving to pay the bills, buy the house and build the picket fence. Nothing! Imagine just having no more burdens - no more cares - no more shame, no more guilt, no more expectations to give in order to get! ... no more having to replenish the well - for when the penny finally drops it automatically fills.

It's like my girlfriend has just dumped me, I have no place to live, all the family is dead, no more money, no more meals - no direction ... nothing ... However many of us already live life like so despite having a mother, father, brother sister, partner, home, and fridge full of food? I imagine there is a damn lot of us living like so. Yep - to think of nothing in the context of death is a beautiful thing that offers a way for us to start living once again. It's a very effective mindset that helps me to get back up on my feet and also pays largely into my tending for a metaphysical view. More often than not ... words will never do.

Night Night ... ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Again ... Nice music D - TY!

[gypsylee]

Thanks Ponder.. That Alan Watts video helped me. I always enjoy his stuff and his voice itself is really soothing.

[jessed03]

Letting go of the story the mind builds up is pretty hard, isn't it? We're conditioned to be attached to this sense of self.

Two things that have helped me are being more present (obviously!) and realising free will is just an illusion. All of those people who hurt you, who did wrong by you... they couldn't help it. I mean, there was no autonomous self in them to make a different decision. They simply reacted subconsciously based on their own upbringing, genetics, inputs, etc. They were as much a victim of chance and circumstance as anyone else. It's just easier to like the good guys and curse the bad ones despite them both being victims of a giant complex process.

I certainly haven't transcended self. I guess making that a goal would be dumb, as Allan says. Just another ego trip. But the two realisations above have definitely made me feel more at ease compared to how I felt 5 years ago. The story just becomes useless, ya know? The past and future are mere dreams. Everybody is as they are because of a process that's been in action since the dawn of time. What's the point of hanging on to all that useless narrative chatter, or grudges, or self-hatred, or tension?

[jessed03]

P.s. yeah, you were right about Watts not being married to the idea of a "god". I found this quote attributed to him, which clears that up a bit.

“For spirituality is a deep sense of inner freedom based on the realization that one’s self is in complete union and harmony with life, with God, with the Self of the universe of whatever that principle may be called. It is the realization that that union has existed from all time, even though one did not know it, and that nothing in all the world nor anything oneself can do is able to destroy it.”

[Ponder]

Your welcome Gypsy. I'd like to believe I have put the chaotic notion of heaven and hell to bed now which took me quite as like countless others, I had been systematically brainwashed from birth. I'd say the last couple of videos have helped to alleviate fears with respect to reincarnation, it's punishment factor, system of self betterment and various other religious connotations. I found a sense of peace in the understanding of "nothing" and just letting that be. I think Alan paints a good picture of what it's like to experience nothing and yet in that moment feel we come feel alive in a totally new way - renewed in every sense of the word, but in a way that lets us feel everything, everywhere at the same time.

Words fail at that point because I don't want to get to lost with the notion that we become like GOD to which our ego starts to cling and then goes on to propose a hundred more questions that only serve to break that connection we just made with being. None of these insights do us any good when the I in ourselves drags back up all that trivial shit that keeps us from our higher self. I think Alan does a good job by taking yet another step and also exposing the I in higher self. It's like when the shit hits the fan we see that light - we give up our things but then the ego hides in our new found self where it makes us think we are GOD. This is where for me ... the New Age concepts that abound are just as self defeating as that which came before it and people go back to the acquisition of success and things! Ego wins - so called enlightened people go back to becoming tubes. Taking things in one end and outputting the other end. Allowing distractions to take place as fear is still taught with regard to the cycle of life. (reincarnation becomes incarceration and now the new driving force for ego to strive as it does)

Letting all these thoughts go, letting all that thinking evaporate by way of just letting the nothing takes it place is truly an awesome experience - although takes us to a place where nothing happens at all. You can be sure the ego will do anything to stop us from reaching such a point. As Alan has well said ... it is the final place in which the ego can not exist.

I'm not sure if I am making any sense - but I get the feel that I am on the right track. This is where my family of the past would all be screaming out that I have become an agent of the anti-christ. New Agers and other various fear based restricted peoples would define such a direction as pessimistic and no more than a reflection of someone spiritually inept. To give everything up is the ultimate threat to ego and it will do all it can to keep us from reaching such a point. So it is that whilst much of our conditioning has been externally influenced, the most crucial and defining battles that take place; do so within.

How finely tuned our society has become at perpetuating the ego by teaching us to rely on the external things, yet at the first sign of internal conflict; how quick they are to diagnose and come up with reliable prescriptions. Something designed that makes the letting go chemically binding and death defying.

I only talk like so because I know well that was the case for myself and although I have thus far given up and avoided the meds ... the process is the same with everything else and I still struggle with everything else. I refuse to accept that it is I that is chemically imbalanced ... far from it ... I am seeing more than ever now where the scales are tipped. Just as I aim not to jump in the ring, I also aim to step off the scales and leave all the deductions just sail on by through basking in the nothingness that awaits those no longer afraid of what comes next.

Yadda Yadda ... Something like that. :

I hear ya Jess - "... The past and future are mere dreams. Everybody is as they are because of a process that's been in action since the dawn of time. What's the point of hanging on to all that useless narrative chatter, or grudges, or self-hatred, or tension?"


That's an awesome line of thought - if we are to derive any kind of benefit from thinking at all. LOL - hehe ... I hear ya ... that resonates well for me. However I did want to touch on more with regard to "will" - more so in the development of that which comes with a cost ... not that "free bs" kind the many tell us we have.

Then there was that quote you shared above. You have me thinking more on that. TY! - This is developing into a good discussion that is rather helpful.

I still think the term GOD is very off putting and throws the message. It makes a lot more sense just leaving it at "in complete union and harmony with life."

Nothing can destroy it, although our society and minds seek do so ... as is the mind's job to conquer and dominate as is our history. Clearly we now have a new challenges if we are to ever let go and start living. It is in the meeting of these challenges that I poner on a new kind of will that is not free.

Something about regardless or predetermining factors - the difference in those natural and not and how we approach the challenge of overcoming those negative influences designed to keep us trapped ... in fact required some kind of effort in the letting go. (rushing now as I have an appointment in less that 30 minutes with my therapist [smiles at the thought and all this text])

I think of John Kabat-Zinn yet again with regard to making effort effortlessly with the intent to do nothing at all. Gotta love how mediation is such a great help when looking to accept and let go of all those things and thoughts that bind us like so.

Not sure I rambled enough ... no matter ...

I don't even have time to edit ... may do so and or just carry on when I later find time.

Thanks for the feed back ... it's helping big time. You have really hit that nail on the head each time with your replies.

Hope this finds you well D ... srry for all the yadda yadda.

Righto ---- I'm off to ramble some more at my appointment. :)

Adios - Until next post.

[jessed03]

Agree. That moment you're able to rise above the monkey mind and just see life in pure awareness is amazing. I've only touched that state for mere seconds recently, but those seconds have been revitalising!

The quote in my last post is from Alan's autobiography. I haven't read it, but the extracts on Goodreads are interesting. He talks about his views on spirituality, "perfect" gurus, and his attitudes towards money, his drinking, his drug use, and women. Seems like you get a look at his whole journey.

You can get the pdf here if you haven't yet read the book: https://www.pdf-archive.com/2016/03/29/in-my-own-way-alan-watts/in-my-own-way-alan-watts.pdf

P.s. D, I hope we're not boring you. I know the convo's turned kind of heavy. :p

[Ponder]

Nice! TY. Just out putting into practice what I read. :) will check this out for sure.

Hows things going D? I just had lunch out with the family. : ) This thread has me in a good space. Please continue as you have shared. I also apologize if the discussion is overly indepth. I can only say once more its been very helpful for me; especially for this time of year.

[Ponder]

Contrary to how it may seem, I actually spend a lot of time living life outside this text box. Catching up with my son and meeting his girlfriend was awesome, as too - was lunch. :) Alas on with the show ... Jesse - You made the Google Search engine with one of your posts:

https://c6.staticflickr.com/1/377/31777554565_b69026ac93_o.jpg http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/laughing/rolling.gif I was searching for more context on the quote was all.


Just before I launch a game ... I thought I would explain a little more re the quote you have passed on. I'll explain why my mind struggles a little with how it may or may not read. 1st the quote:

“For spirituality is a deep sense of inner freedom based on the realization that one’s self is in complete union and harmony with life, with God, with the Self of the universe of whatever that principle may be called. It is the realization that that union has existed from all time, even though one did not know it, and that nothing in all the world nor anything oneself can do is able to destroy it.”

GOD in Christian terms is known as the Alpha and Omega. The Beginning & End! Hmmm that does not quite sound like a cycle does it? Or is that what that is supposed to mean? I guess not when you consider that Christian believe we only get one life and it's what we choose under the banner of Free Will that determines what happens after our one and only spin. Yea ...Watt's is definitely into looping despite thus far me not knowing his spin on reincarnation. (although I don't think he regards it with too much attention? - I'll check out more of his take on that a little later)



Christians do seem hell bent on dominating the earth and all things on and in it. The Christian Bible - Genisis chapter 1 Verse 26 of the Kings James Bible → "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth."

That very goal/aim of mankind is very much alive and has but nearly wiped us all out. It just seems a matter of time. Nonetheless I can see that Watt's is talking about one's union in the knowing of how our inner being is at one with the universe and that it is that - that no thing or oneself can do to destroy it.
__________________________________________________ _______________________

Srry to confuse ... Now I can sum up my own conflict when reading that quote ... mostly two things. 1. At first it does sound as though Watt's believes in a GOD - however after unlearning much of what I thought I once knew, I can see he is instead redefining in open terms just what the GOD really be and indeed ... it is far from the external source that Christians believe. Undoubtedly - Watt's must also been known as an AntiChrist. I certainly hope so at any rate. : ) 2. - that Man has indeed destroyed a once deep founded respect and connection between themselves and the planet + all things that live on it. But now having taken the time to review the quote ... I can see he is referring to the union that comes about through knowing that all things are one and the same. That - that cannot be destroyed as much as man will seek to dominate. We will always remain connected no matter how much one seeks to separate. The latter is what is creating all the conflict on our earth and why man's only hope is to do away with such nonsense.

The beginning part of that quote really hits the nail on the head ... don't you think ... with respect that we need not beg, be ashamed or bend our knees in order to be free. In this respect I can see how it is that we are in fact born without sin; not the other way around. Moreover it seems to be more fact that it's man's will that we be corrupted in order to fit in. Such a Will comes with great cost and is far from free as they would have us instead beleive.

Yea - that quote works really well now and I am less conflicted with it. That's the thing with having been brought up in a pentecostal/charismatic evangelical church. It takes years years to undo the psychological damage. Most people never recover. Mental illness abounds coming out the other end.

Thank Goodness I have found the AntiChrist and thank GOD (lol) that I have found more than one. Hell - I want to become one. ;) That's how free of the fear I have now become. Very liberating, despite the challenge of life itself.

Now time to go play and have some fun!

LOADING .................................................. ....................................

[Ponder]

Reality Check. It's one thing to take in the message and then another to actually clean house. I think this is where the knowing is not always as good as it seems and often falls short if words is all one can do. So it is that I now hold myself accountable as should be the intent of any dairy worth it's weight in text. I took home a little advice after today's therapy session and I will now give it the respect I normally do. I value my sessions so as not everyone is lucky enough to have someone listen and help on such a level.

Recalibrating My Circadian Rhythm:

It's been quite some time now that I have not been up and down like a yo yo as has been the case for many years previous. My routine has come out of sync because I have not adjusted for the seasons. I have never been in a steady state for 12 to 178 months running in my entire life. There is more to it ... however I think that is not enough for now. I'll think to give this aspect a name later on and fine tune the pros and cons of changing seasons for those of us learning how to stay balanced with whatever routine/methods for consecutive seasons. I gained a lot of healing after researching and setting my routine based on the circadian rhythm. Being new to this kind of living - I missed a few beats that slowly went out of sync but did not realise until after a third of the way into the next season. Yadda Yadda ... lesson learned ... time for a recalibration.

Immediate adjustments can include waking up earlier to beat the heat and return to greeting the dawn like a solar panel preparing for the day's events. : ) Yep ... that about sums up the importance of syncing with the seasons and how I have miss more than a few beats. Throw in some meditation time when I get back and then fine tune my activities after that. Simple things like that can make a massive improvement down to the way I retune my digestive system, eliminate useless cravings, increase nutritional utilization and improve automatic healthier responses in all that I do.

Definitely return to walking but watch the timing re the heat - Stop going to the gym - swap it out for some basic stretching and various home routines but way less emphasis on physique but loads more on feelings - both sensory and emotional.

Re-examine the value of insights recently received with all the time thus far spent regarding Alan Watts, these posts and the reading of his books?
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ________________________

Regarding the latter. Hmmmmmmmmmm Now I have a better concept of the Pantheism view; or at least I think I do? How has this changed my own? - If anything perhaps I have been better placed to create my own acceptable term of what the term GOD should be if I am to allow such a loaded word simply be ... Moreover that I no longer place any weight on such a term and thus let it float on by as I would like to intend for thoughts here on in.

I now consider the benefits of dreaming and back off the intellectual resistance to allow for more feeling. In all that I have opened myself up to thus far - I figure that whilst still living or actually being open - allowing for the process to Watts's concept of renewal (a far cry from a Christian revival) to take effect; [thus this reality check or this reality check in context with such] I should now ponder how to use this new found energy so that the portal remain open as long as need be.

Esoteric considerations - I have no problem with this form of contemplation. It seems very much like some kind of threat or undesirable trait among the more rigid thinkers? Rigid thinkers is as best I can say. I really don't feel threatened by it at all? Perhaps I don't understand the term very well? I think I best describe it more as Esoteric Writing - I've read it's like an art form and a waning one at that. One Google search comes up with Philosophy Between the Lines THE LOST HISTORY OF ESOTERIC WRITING (http://www.press.uchicago.edu/ucp/books/book/chicago/P/bo18692306.html) - No doubt more definitions can be extracted the more one reads - but it's in the writing that I now prefer to express where I am at.

Basically I now bring this part of my feelings to light as I embrace that nothingness as recently stated. This is how I conjure up my own connection to whatever form or field I find myself in at whatever experience I am in. Yes - this here comes the mumbo jumbo that requires more intuition than it does reasoning. I'm thinking this is a good space to be in that gives little room for ego. Of course whilst I write this in the open I am very much aware that my ego will have me doubt my every word ... and tell my I must be careful of what others think and so on and on ... thus the return to freestyling and doing my best to be as honest as I believe I can be.

Belief - I have not quite finished speculating on the pros and cons with regard to that term as well ... more so redefining that term like I have now done with that of G-O-D ... I think I swap that one out for that of "knowing" and then calibrate that perception to John Kabat-Zinn's analogy of being OK with the not knowing anything at all ... the no need for striving and or better said "the adoption of a systematic intentional approach that requires next to no effort when done correct" -

So it is that I look forward to shutting down that I may be able to create the space in order to appreciate such existence - during my waking states. Longer, lasting states of clarity and peace of mind. More than just blissful moments.

A bit like continually charging from sleeping, from mediating, from walking, from eating and from breathing; a return to being rather than task orientated living. (No more complacent clinical perspectives.) The complete opposite to consuming as has been most of what I've been doing. More BS and hypocrisy is being weaned with each page of this latest thread. I have been purposely repeating the buying and selling - giving in to the such a compulsive addiction until I have nothing left. Perhaps not nothing ... but the very basics of just having what's really valued and nothing else ... in as much as the beauty of having nothing ... yet retaining something. That being finding the perfect balance.

Yadda Yadda - I now look forward to my slumber ... perhaps an exotreic dream awaits - GOD forbid.

Seriously ... tonights post has brought me much relief. It's why I do what I do. I look forward to that time I can actually move on. I can say that in my book at least, that this space is highly valued and far from wasted.

Adios ... until next post. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzz

[Ponder]

Back on track. ;)

[Ponder]

Have you seen this one Jesse? Do you know anyone else like him that does not present like some kind of religious guru with crowds following them? The world really is in short supply of these kinds of people. Is good that he has left a legacy of teachings though.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LXiSPpfM54

Part 2 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCv32GAUG7w)

[Dahila]

well I am lost, completely lost :(

[jessed03]

Depressing really. That video is almost 50 years old, and since then, things have only gotten worse re humans destroying their environment. Our culture has also gone backwards too, imo. We live in a culture not only where ego is accepted, but actually encouraged. Advertising has it all worked out and people can't even see it. The fight club quote about it having us work jobs we hate to buy shit we don't need comes to mind. We're destroying the earth through over consumption, just to keep the ego illusion alive. As long as people have brand new products every few months, the illusion never has to be broken. But, it's a ponzi scheme, and there will come a time, probably soon, where there's nothing left to borrow from the earth and she starts demanding payment for our actions.

Watts was a rarity, wasn't he. His use of the phrase "waking up" is so much more appropriate than the word "enlightenment". Wake up from your sleep walk, take a good look around, and see what's really going on. That's something everyone can do, compared to this idea of enlightenment you see in Buddhism.

I don't think I've come across anyone like Watts. It's a very, very rare thing to hear somebody lecture on life without preaching. I just go to lots of places and pick what resonates with me. Recently I've checked out Sam Harris, Krishnamurti, Daisetsu Teitaro Suzuki (Alan Watts' mentor), and Thich Nhat Hanh. And I've been reading about transpersonal psychology, which aims to reconcile Western psychology with enlightenment experiences.

But so far I haven't found anybody like Watts who I can listen to for hours.

[jessed03]

well I am lost, completely lost :(

What's up, D? :(

[Ponder]

That's OK D ... Same here.

I'll switch things up by letting you know how I go with eating one meal a day. :)

Jesse ... I think it gets better once we come to accept what is. Depression is only one of many emotions that we go through and I think he makes some really great points about how it is that we view. Going beyond the contrast by taking it all in rather than getting stuck with our limiting linear perspective. Instead as a species we just think in terms of text and binary forms. That really hit home for me ... not just with my own incessant writing but that of others as well .. especially how I read.

However it need not be like that ... now that we have heard the message - how do we act? I think he clears that up with how we choose to view ... how we hold our our image - how we hold our relationship with what we see ... how we value that ... how do we disconnect with all that crap that binds us to the addictions and illusions we currently choose to see. How does choice work into the equation and what is our responsibility regardless of all these speculation.

I got to keep moving ... I do apologize if my direction is upsetting others and am prepared to stop the discussion and more onto something else.

I have deleted all most of me egocentric videos and looking to move on soon enough.

Catch up soon ... Thanks for your reply and more names.
__________________________________________________

I actually take a little solace in the sobering truth although in his book I have now moved onto ... "Become What You Are" I note something he said on coming to understand just how insoluble we and everything really be. It is in that understanding that we then have the opportunity to fully let go where such depressive views fully dissolve.


Not sure if that makes sense ... but that answer is there as much as Tolle presents. The latter is really were we need to be in order to overcome that feeling of doom which only drags us back down again. I'm happy to further discuss, but once again ... happy to change the topic completely if you wish?

I'm pretty keen on eating once a day and see how I go with that. That in itself I can banter on and produce loads of chatter!

... But let's not be quick to let depressive thoughts undermine overcoming the opportunity to overcome.

I think too many of us are simply distracted and do not have the strength to tackle this topic ... which again is why I am trying to find another place where perhaps I am just in the way? Perhaps that's it ... I'm just in the way - being here in this forum? I know there are a lot of people who would like to see me go ... including myself.

I'm working on it! I think I am getting pretty close.

[Ponder]

_____________________

His background view and tuition on how to look reminded me instantly of a photo I once took: (D you have seen this before - You know I am big on trees)

https://c7.staticflickr.com/9/8221/8444496606_20860ef39c_o.jpg

I slept and walked among those trees - A relationship that's now been renewed and gives more meaning than that of my ego's attempt to have me give into downgraded feelings. It is as is - My ability to connect with what is - is way stronger than that to which my ego would rather have me cling. @ least in this present moment as I seek to no longer seek and take in as Watts suggests.
_________________

[Ponder]

How's your health going Jesse and what do you do to get through the days?

[jessed03]

Things aren't too bad, P. I'm battling stuff like the back pain alone, which is a bit of a nightmare, but I'm not suffering really, which is something. I just stay within my limits and get on with things best I can lol.

The healthcare system here is a bit of a nightmare. I know you've touched on this before: it's conveyor belt stuff. The system does the bare minimum it can to get you back to being a working taxpayer again. Patch folks up then kick 'em out by their arse straight back into the factory again!

I've been doing a little writing from home to earn enough to eat, but it doesn't really fund much else. Specialists seem to cost an absolute bomb these days (some are like £200 an hour!). In the new year I'm going to try to find somebody who can holistically balance the body and mind, but I know that's going to be a challenge.

I try and do what I can myself. Diet changes and stress reduction and stuff you can do without anybody's help. I've just been chipping away and making improvements. As you can imagine, I take great interest in the changes you make. It's been really satisfying to see the positive changes you've made over the years. I didn't even recognise you in that video you posted a few months back!!!

[Ponder]

Glad the pain is bearable Jesse. I still struggle daily with the tear in my ass whole. I have no choice but to balance things just right ... not unless I love debilitating pain. In some ways the pain has motivated me more than not.

What kind of stuff you writing about? I'm a little confused about your intention for the new year? Are you looking to pay for services to assist you holistically? If so ... what kind of services? Reiki, Naturopath, ... ?

I definitely recommend looking into things within your own control that do not need anyone else. At least for the long term.

I'm please if you're able to get any kind of inspiration out of my own efforts, but I think it goes without saying that the only people that can help ourselves ... is ourselves. Of course you already know that. :)
________________________________________

I tend to go to extremes. So instead of cutting back to one meal a day ... I have decided to keep it simple and just eat Two. Stepping stones and see where that leads. It only took a few snacks and allowing some flavonoids to creep in that threw me off track. On my second day now and feeling ten times better.

That's all for today ... just going to zone out with some PC gaming and watch some drama on the box. Drama of my own choosing. :)

[Ponder]

__________________________________________________ ___________________________________
________________________


"To understand these things, you must live and move with them as they are alive. The same is true of the universe: no amount of intellectual analysis will explain it, for philosophy and science can only reveal its mechanism, never its meaning or, as the Chinese say, its Tao." Become What You Are - Alan Watts

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/726/31703394631_19df2257a3_o.pnghttps://c1.staticflickr.com/1/327/31703395341_abedcc7ded_o.gifhttps://c1.staticflickr.com/1/712/31672547712_57d93b23eb_o.png


Become What You Are - Alan Watts

"...Another master set a pitcher before two of his disciples. “Do not call it a pitcher,” he said, “but tell me what it is.” One replied, “It cannot be called a piece of wood.” The master, however, was not satisfied with this answer, and he turned to the other disciple who simply knocked the pitcher over and walked away.

This action had the master’s full approval. It will be asked whether these antics have the least connection with religion, even with ordinary sanity. They are regarded by the exponents of Zen as full of the deepest significance, and when we remember that Zen has been, beyond question, one of the most powerful influences in shaping the art and culture of the Far East, such behavior is entitled to respect. Has it some symbolic meaning? What is it about? The answer is that it has no symbolic meaning, and that it is about nothing. But it is something, and that something is that very obvious but much ignored thing—life. The Zen master is in fact demonstrating life in its actuality; without words or ideas he is teaching his disciples to know life directly. Sometimes in answer to a religious question he will give a smack on the face, returning a reality for an abstraction. If he gave a reasoned answer, the disciple would be able to analyze it, to subject it to intellectual dissection, and to imagine a mere lifeless formula as a living truth. But with a smack, a bird, a pitcher, a heap of dishes there can be no mistake. A smack is here one moment and gone the next. There is nothing you can catch hold of, nothing other than a most lively fact, as much alive as the passing moment which can never be made to stay. And a bird is a bird; you hear its song, but you cannot seize the notes to make them continue.

It just is, and is gone, and you feel the beauty of its song precisely because the notes do not wait for you to analyze them. Therefore the Zen master is not trying to give you ideas about life; he is trying to give you life itself, to make you realize life in and around you, to make you live it instead of being a mere spectator, a mere pedant absorbed in the dry bones of something which the life has long deserted. A symphony is not explained by a mathematical analysis of its notes; the mystery of a woman’s beauty is not revealed by a postmortem dissection; and no one ever understood the wonder of a bird on the wing by stuffing it and putting it in a glass case. To understand these things, you must live and move with them as they are alive. The same is true of the universe: no amount of intellectual analysis will explain it, for philosophy and science can only reveal its mechanism, never its meaning or, as the Chinese say, its Tao." Become What You Are - Alan Watts

[Ponder]

Righto - Just ironing out some kinks from this afternoon's walk with Alan Watts. hehe ( I love Text To Speech!!!) Man I gotta tell ya Jesse, I have never come across so many double binds, ironies, contradictions and the like regarding Life, Society and so on all in one sitting when reading/listening through Alan's Books. He really does an excellent job of helping one come to see that there really is No Way Out, gives new meaning to the word Despair and in this realizations guides out of an atypical depressive response into a more accepting one that completely dissolves likewise negative conditioned responses based on preconceived-needs and wants. The later he does well by exposing the ideology of society and how we have been hoodwinked but moreover guiding one to finally understanding that it's futile to go on as is in a mechanised world - that there is fact ... No Way Out.

No way out of What? Hmmmm - He seems to really hit home with how Society is out to cheat death. I can see now why he focuses a lot of his talks on death. What better place to start ... what better place to expose the fear mongering. Then working back from the Imprinted Fear of Death, he does an excellent job at unraveling the mechanism by which society seeks to control and also highlights well the futility in seeking. The latter most certainly a double bind as most everything else I am coming to see.

Non-Doing can also play a role in the way we think - “Get rid of knowledge; eject wisdom, and the people will be benefited a hundredfold.” - Lao-tzu

Then there is that other guy you mentioned before but I have forgotten his name already - "To define is to confine" ... is to me meaning the same thing. Watt's context is spotlighting supposed knowledge of what the ideal way of life is. This is followed with the mechanisms of preconceived needs for seeking, finding purpose & wants for setting goals, achieving, winning and so on. All systems created within the illusion so many of us are lost.

I got to say - I just can't get enough of Watts! LOL - I'm no groupie or sheepish follower ... It's just that I have been tending this way for most of my life - dare I say - SEEKING. : )Sigh ... and there you have it → yet another double bind. BUT - like I picked up from more than just a few Dharma Talks, it seems to all come down to the way we hold our thoughts. Thoughts arise from a perspective where we are less bound, whilst thinking typically involves stressful posturing - both inside and out. The former just happens, whilst the latter is pushed.

Concentration is quite the topic. It is a "... seemingly paradoxical state, since it is at once the maximum of consciousness and the minimum of ego-feeling, which somewhat gives the lie to those systems of Western psychology which identify the conscious principle with the ego. Similarly, it is the maximum of mental activity or efficiency, and the minimum of mental purposiveness, since one cannot simultaneously concentrate and expect a result from concentration." Become What You Are - Alan Watts

There is a LOT of insightful text that follows on, however like Watts is always saying ... to include it would further complicate matters. This reminds me of how much I change the examples my therapists uses because I am always having to explain that I am not aiming to be more than I already am - Type Of Thing. Thankfully the therapist I see is somewhat open to my seeking and non seeking / non - doing / non participatory of mainstream existing. That's another story.

Anyways ... I've reached my limit one again ...

I think the Now Way Out scenario is coming to understand that there is → Become What You Are - Alan Watts "no way, no method, no technique which you or I can use to come into accord with the Tao, the Way of Nature, because every how, every method implies a goal. And we cannot make the Tao a goal any more than we can aim an arrow at itself. If we once get into the tangled state of the arrow which is trying to shoot itself, the self trying to change itself, we can’t do anything to stop it. So long as we think or feel that perhaps we can stop it, that there is some way, violent or subtle, difficult or easy, to make ourselves unselfish, the contradiction will continue or get worse. We have to see that there is no way. But in the state where we have realized that there is no way to be found, no result to be gained, the vicious circle breaks. Ouroboros, the snake eating his tail, has become conscious all the way round, and knows at last that that tail is the other end of his head." Become What You Are - Alan Watts

It's all coming together one step at a time, yet there is another lesson I am picking up ... which is making the ordeal of seeking less tiresome; that true insights just happen. More often than not when we discover that there is No Way Out - or better said for me - No Way! NOT - No One Way ... but No Way at all!!!

Most people can't mediate because they are looking - looking to obtain ... so it is that when not looking ... but holding with focused intent that brings about a form of concentration where ego does not exist - then yea ... is good to reach that state of nothing ... which then brings me back to watts talk on Death. : ) heheheehehehehehe

Is all good ... I love this stuff. Although I feel as if I am past that atypical stage of being depressed when first discovery that there really is Now Way Out whatsoever ... I am careful of how society's 24/7 influencing mechanisms can easily draw me back in ... but again I am loving how much more there is to the insights the Watt's presents ... At first it might appear to be Doom & Gloom, but if you keep an open ear for long enough you soon discover just how liberating much of this information really is. Like how to be free within the prison so no need to go looking for an escape. Yes - something thinking is required, however like I was trying to say before ... it's all in the way we hold our thoughts and also in the living. Just read once more the last quote I shared above as I think it really says it all.

Night Night .... ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Ponder]

One Second ... I forgot the part about DESPAIR! : ) I really connected with the following passage in a good way. I seem to really connect with oneness in a healthy and peaceful way during those times my self has been completely guttered! Where my illusionary world has been ripped from underneath me:

Become What You Are - Alan Watts - "... And the connection reveals the one deepest and most central principle of those Asian philosophies which so puzzle the Western mind by identifying the highest wisdom with what, to us, seems the doctrine of abject despair. Indeed, the word despair in a particular sense is the proper translation of the Hindu–Buddhist term nirvana—to “de-spirate,” to breathe out, to give up the ghost. We cannot understand how the Asians manage to equate this despair with ultimate bliss—unless, as we are prone to suppose, they are after all a depraved and spineless people, long accustomed to fatalism and resignation."


Despair - that point in which I often discover that there is Now Way Out! - SIGH - To Breathe Out (detox) - To Give Up the Ghost. So True! No place for Ego in all that is there? :) The West and all its ideological BS is very quick to negatively spin the lessons to come out of such eastern philosophy.

I'm tending to see the deeper meanings to feeling ones despair - allowing negative emotions to be as is in order to really go through the process of grieving. To grieve the loss of oneself.

Yea ... that's a good bridge to leave these musings for the night.

Now I got to sleep ...

Good Night. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/sleep/sleep.gif

[Ponder]

__________________________________________________ ____


I am in the moment whilst preparing for tomorrow's events - the following vibes are helping me keep in sync:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPni755-Krg

[Ponder]

So what's all this jabberwocky about. I was getting lost with all that exercising and lost sight of just how much I really don't have to do if I get the mix just right. The vanity & self centeredness of what most of us have come to see as our image is where my ego was taking me off track. If there was one thing I could clearly see going back over my Youtube videos ... is the bitterness that still dwells within me. I think a new language in which to express when drawing from my past will better assist in providing less space for my ever present ego to exist. That's what all this jabberwocky is about.

Now that I have killed off more time - I now go put some love and attention into my midday meal. On that Note:

My New Eating Plan.
I am seemingly doing well with my new balancing act of 2 Main Meals a Day "without" any snacks. I have an 18 hour window without food then a 6 hour slot in which to medicate with food. : ) It's really more to do with the window periods of eating and not so much the number of times I eat. Long term goal is to eat as less as possible with fasting breaks in between. It has been the one meal a day lifestyle that I am now contemplating that is now seeing me take back control of my food consumption & watching what I eat. I am going back to eating as less of a means to comfort but solely to meet most basic needs.

It's been an awesome reality check to see just how much my emotions have been controlling me whilst under the spell of me ego. The drugs of addiction are well hidden in most of our foods that it does not take much of a slip to find oneself again pacified by the system he aims to dissolve. My energy levels were drastically falling and emotions once again starting to drag me down. It's only been a few days but my renewed focus is has increased my clarity, upped my energy and significantly improved my sleep.

Now ... I go meditate whilst making my medicine. I still enjoy my food very much - It actually tastes way way better when I eat like this & I only eat 1/3rd as much :) http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/thanksgiving/eating-grapes.gif

Thankfully I have been able to time tomorrow's family Banquet withing my window of eating. We're also having it at our place which means WAY less poison to grace our tables.

[Ponder]

_________________________________________________

Once I hear the music I begin to see just how special I already am and no matter how negative I allowed myself to feel; in due course with mindful observation my pain subsides and I begin to heal:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jk5i4GX1BJY



Stay tuned ... we'll work this BS out. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/yes/winking-thumbs-up-smiley-emoticon.gif

[jessed03]

I like the cartoon that accompanies that vid. He's so busy watching the clock it ends up getting him killed. A nice metaphor for how we look too much at symbols and ignore content.

Anyway, while I'm here, I wanted to wish you guys a Merry Christmas. I'm not a fan of the phrase as I hate the pressure Christmas puts on people to be happy. But hey, it's a social convention and you guys know I mean well!

I'm gonna spend some time with the family, which should be nice. I've been pretty isolated in thought recently.


http://www.laughandlike.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/8.jpg

[goingtoofast]

A provoking line of thought here, Ponder. I thank you. My immediate response was to close my eyes and contemplate my inspiration/expiration habit, also described as inhalation/exhalation. I expire consistently and obsessively. But that action is interlaced with inspire. And in that moment when I forget to isolate and identify, the two are inseparable. Who's breathing whom? Sort of. Thank you for the stimulation.

[Ponder]

LOL Jesse - Love the meme. My daughter is caught up on that drama with teaching it too her son. I guess she will have to learn the hard way as well. Thanks for the well meaning sentiment. I too am looking forward to spending time with others.

I hear what your saying about thoughts and isolation. I'm learning to become more accepting of my thoughts since digging deep with Alan Watts's writings, but yea - it still feels like a very cold world to me.

------

Hello goingtoofast - Well said. Makes no sense to separate the inseparable. I guess it comes down to content like Jesse just pointed out.

Nice to meet you. :)

[Ponder]

Trust me; I know what I'm talking about ... http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/drink/very-drunk.gif ... errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr rrrrrrrrrrrr - never again .......... why ... why did I do it ..... http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/sick/thud-faint-smiley-emoticon.gif

[Ponder]

See what happens when we go to social gatherings ... Sigh.

[Ponder]

After Xmas lunch:

https://c3.staticflickr.com/6/5597/31710235242_9ab296b7ca_o.jpg


Sometime later:

https://c7.staticflickr.com/1/531/31484814310_e958c5d3c5_o.jpg


Earlier on - Playing World Of Tanks:

https://c2.staticflickr.com/1/730/31858051025_b8a3a130a2_o.jpg

It’s OK, we are protecting the Whales and dolphins - :
Again, again!

[Ponder]

Thought I would share this moment. It's the first time in a LONG time that we have "all" been gathered at the same time.


My two daughters are at the back of the table, my wife in the middle and then me in for foreground. My youngest son on other side of table with his girlfriend. Then of course my dear grandson in the background playing in a makeshift tub. :)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/749/31711309072_50aacee96d_b.jpg (https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/749/31711309072_2d7472dbe9_o.jpg)

_________

Together Again:

https://c3.staticflickr.com/1/730/31821347426_8edce420df_b.jpg


Righo - Moment has come on gone now ... I think I will go blow out more on the left overs. Hope everyone had as good a time as could be had, but moreover - I hope this finds you well. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

My oldest Son & I are no longer in contact.- I try not wish too much into that - In fact letting go is something I am working on with regard to all in my family, but that's another story.

[Ponder]

It was a good day - this concludes my Xmas photos: Dahlia ... I don't think I will fus over the weight gain - Lisa looks happy in this. Bit of color in her grey here but better yet - loads of spirit after seeing all the kids back together again! All else seems rather insignificant after todays events. Hope you guys had a cracker get together your end. Over & Out ... I'm off to collapse in front of the TV.

_______


'All else seems rather insignificant after today's events.' Crikey! → I'm aging real quick! - But that's OK - I'm learning to meet my end before it comes. ;)

https://c8.staticflickr.com/1/723/31742952231_59ea7ee967_b.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/photos/71988794@N08/31742952231/sizes/o/)

[jessed03]

The pic of you and the little one playing tanks is awesome!!

[Dahila]

Oh it is beautiful D. all family together, I just had a nice long phone conversation with my son, he will come January 5 for a visit. Then my daughter almost cooked everything and we had proper Xmas Eve celebration (Polish tradition) I had a piece of her cheesecake which was awesome. I had eat more than usually but it does not look that i gained anything through night. I had even one shot of Polish Vodka with them. It was difficult with my social phobia but I made it;))
I went to bed completely exhausted and btw market was better than I had consider it was 3 hours shorter :(
I sitting here and no energy at all. I think I may have lazy day or maybe................go downstairs to workshop and make some awesome things...........You guys look happy and it is the most important. I know the moments do not last long but they leave for kids something to remember, I envy you the little one, Mine is 10 soon will be as tall as I am and she had a bit of make up hehehe and small hills. Where my grandchild went, when she was sitting on my lap.............. I got a quiet few kisses yesterday. She was upset cause I did not want to play monopoly with them :) Could not do it ;)

[Ponder]

Thx Jesse. I'll have him with a lvl 10 Tank soon enough. Then we will sit high above the beach line and knock all the fishing boats. So look out! : )

Glad you had a good time D. :) I've gained 4kg now. I gain very quick if I do not watch myself. Chemically speaking my genes are easily triggered when it comes to addictions - the flavonoids, sweets, salts, and all the designer bindings in anything that's not natural. Not meaning to blame genetics, but addictions run very deep in my family and chemically speaking some of us are indeed more prone than others. I of course added to this very much and my kids now also have to watch their own reactions and bla bla.

Here was my more controlled response this morning:

https://c7.staticflickr.com/1/546/31835592966_a158c8786b_o.jpg

Cold Press as always. Yea - this is me being more responsible. I'm so glad you keep things real D! So So True about how these moments don't last that long. Various family members already closing their Facebook accounts, blocking their kin in skype and putting others on their spam lists with regards to calls and text. All over trivial things such as they did not like the way their hair was or their expression during a photo snap. Nothing to do with in here - but more a Facebook thing that has since escalated with ... well you know how bitterness and resentment grows. All over "image" - that stuff I have been reading about. LOL So So True. Our damn egos! The more we privatise ourselves, the more we see ourself as external ... the more the system has us pegged and the longer our species shall remain sick. yadda yadda whatever : )

Just saying you hit the nail on the head ... and with pretty much everything you said ... and I love how you keep doing that with keeping things real. So glad you did. So many of us try to cling to these happy go lucky events. We should be playing the music all day long every day and not going back to a life based on images, things and ... lets face it - more want and greed.

Yes D - I agree it's hard mingling with the social phobia (thing/label) - thankfully for me ... although a rare occasion, I got to have such a gathering at our place. My issue is with the world and not my family - however the sickness as just said is alive and well embedded deep within all our families. After all ... like they say ... we are all one. :) Also as previously said about 10 posts back and many times agreed upon before - the family unit/concept is quite a diversionary force within our society. Moreover a negative influence in many ways BUT that's another story. Basically plays into the philosophy of separatism and all that kind of thing. Yadda Yadda ... therefor is is that I have no illusions when it comes to such Xmas and the other wide array of pretentious gatherings.

TY for this opportunity to express like so. Once again ... glad you said as you did.
_______________

YEA - they do indeed grow up quick!!! - People expect me to see my kids as adults - workers - individuals - and rar rar rar ... same pretentious BS again. But you know me. I am not the full quid! I am inappropriately seeing my (and I now question "my"' they are really not mine in any sense of the word my- again part of the problem that be - yea yea) these adults for the kids they really be. I mean not dysfunctional adult kids like many of us be in this "image fixated nary" world (imaginary) - but alas I can only hold them up to the sky or bounce them of my belly for so many years. As they get bigger I just give them hugs and gentle touches no matter how bunkered down they get or retaliatory bla bla bla.

When it comes to my own ←(again language fails me again [perhaps ours as in yours and mine - mankind's]) - I will either be seen as a loving jokester or satan himself. The former me just trying my best regardless of can do no good and when each of us in their most balanced state - joking is good. The later - well ... we are each responsible for the way we act and choose to look. No good can come from judging the other in regard to that.

As for the World? I am learning to treat them like my family as best I can. No doubt the more I'm looking into philosophies that challenge current mainstream ideal - the more I and any others like us:
... will be seen as Satan himself.http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/horror/best-devil-smiley-emoticon.gif

[goingtoofast]

Nice to meet you, as well, Ponder. Content, indeed. The inside surface of the bottle being of more use than the outside surface. Although the two surfaces are continuous. Maybe a bit like my self and my actions. I shall watch the Alan Watts video another time or two. His laugh is infectious.

[Ponder]

Well said GTF - In your own time. Don't mind me and all my little Links I throw in my here dairy. I'm like a sponge for the most part just gleaning as I go. I have to admit Alan Watts has me soaking up longer in one spot than I normally do.

Speaking of gleaning info on Self Help - I came across this following video. It's a long one so don't expect anyone to check it out unless they're really into that kind of thing. Align Your Thoughts & Feelings For A New Destiny - The title sounds a bit new age for my liking and also misleading for my brain which is often caught up with conflicting information ... but moreso from a point that I'm constantly getting in the way of myself.

Anyways - I like to take bits and pieces from all other the place and once again ... there is some really great stuff in this video. Sadly my wife is not so open to this kind of thing. It saddens me because her condition of Multiple Sclerosis is often used as an example where these stress reduction techniques have been used to great effect with many debilitating conditions. Alas ... I have been spending years on this kind of thing for my own recovery from a lifetime of depression, anxiety and bla bla bla and rar rar rar.

I like to mix up the science, philosophy and spirituality and it would seem these elements are becoming more one as the years roll on. Having said that though ... many camps adopt elements of the other without really knowing the bigger picture that each specialises in (yes and no - which is why is best to check them all out as well as those that intermingle) and when done more as a means for popularizing as opposed to true seeking and giving ... well ... imo - it pays to have a good feel for when this is going on. Otherwise it gets real conflicting as revolving doors in the brain can start to play havoc. I have no idea who this guy is or what books he is selling - or what he is promoting. Having listening to this in parts I do get a feel that there is a lot of great info in this vid covering a wide area of expanded consciousness and retraining the brain ... without using the brain - learning to drop the eog without using the ego - some good insights regarding mediation and much much more.

Generally I don't like TED style talks and or anying gathering that feels like its selling something ... but I figure it's worth a good watch for anyone interested in understanding how our thoughts and feelings get in the way as too how we can use such knowledge to heal ourselves in a very Very powerful and long lasting way. Yadda Yadda ... (another example of lifestyle change) Which is why this kind of talk is mostly reserved for people who are at the crossroads at some point in their life where remaining sick and powerless is no longer an option.

anyways - this is what I am listening to atm ... will most likely end up skimming one of his books as I'm nearly done with watt's two books I recently bought and will go over those again later on as I often do. A few times now I have read comments in here where people whine about the time others use to work through their issues as if doing so is a waste of time. Not the case for me. I don't consider it a waste - it's part of my medication and therapy to which I would add costs me nothing other than the cheap books. The world is complex and if you want to stay ahead of all the mindless condition and perception management that goes on 24/7 ... it's going to take a little effort in learning how to live ... really live that is. Not end up reliant on a system that thrives on mindless sheep and the sick.

Again that Title does not work for me (old worn out words in a world full of hype in this current self help age $$$) BUT - there is a LOT of nuggets of info in here that I think is really on the mark. But then is easier for me to say given all the books I have read as too my motivation to work through the conflicts, double binds and even the stuff I really don't know.

I need a new plan - I am striving to try less in all that I do yet my continually posting would make such a claim to be untrue. Fact is ... it's no drama for me to belt out the text in here as is also just another part of what I do - naturally so - I suggest more people try it - freestyle yadda yadda ... and bla bla blaaaaa

... without further ado:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3LN0IXmnT8&list=PLTtbhjtVLRyRwqyUzakHlYtj UVVzt0pEA&index=1

For me - I definitely have to take care with the relationship of "striving" to attain in this talk ... The knowledge is great and that's all I am taking in (mostly a refresher for me which is good) ... The brainwashing of charismatic and pentecostal churches have me extremely sensitive when presenters use the tears of others, the wonderment stories with - You Too could be like this lady - and rar rar rar ... despite there being a churchy feel in the end of this presentation ... the information is still good and I'll probably pick up and look for another spin somewhere else. The info has potential ... is best I can say. Basically I have to put my bias aside to better hear what's on offer. The knowing how to do it - as opposed to simply knowing is a fair statement which I am all about. Testing things out for myself rather than just taking someone else's word for it. That much they do end this talk on and is something more of us in places like this would do well to adopt. Stop relying on the same old things that leave us in the same old spot. Not when it comes to just getting by and waking up in a brain fog. For me ... I'm over having to exercise ... getting caught back up in the concept of image ... even with regard to weight loss. It's all part of the consumption game ... I feel it's time for me to move on so hence my return to all this kind of contemplation.

Night night ... that's enough editing. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[jessed03]

Anyways - I like to take bits and pieces from all other the place and once again ... there is some really great stuff in this video. Sadly my wife is not so open to this kind of thing. It saddens me because her condition of Multiple Sclerosis is often used as an example where these stress reduction techniques have been used to great effect with many debilitating conditions

Why isn't she open to that kind of thing? Is it because she thinks spirituality is a bit woo-woo? If so, I can understand. Things like collective consciousness, reincarnation, killing the ego and letting the universe live through you do sound kind of kooky. Hey, they may end up being true, but I guess I can't blame people for being skeptical of it.

The good thing though is that you can get many of the interesting parts of Eastern philosophy in a secular way now. Here, the NHS provides free mindfulness courses for people. Even people like Jon Zinn and Sam Harris talk about mindfulness and meditation from a medical perspective. Nobody's required to believe in any dogma to get the good stuff.

Is there no avenue to introduce Lisa to new ideas in a completely secular way?

[Ponder]

From a religious perspective the chastising, victimising, & emotional abuse that we were all subject to as a family and individually was devastating. The church, schools & affiliated religious community groups facilitated negative environmental conditioning that created a host of predispositions that are to this day still plaguing Lisa, myself and the kids. (now adults in one form or another) Some of us are affected more than others. I cannot underestimate the power of the church when it comes to the psychological and physical damage it inflicts on the whole; of society. The cost is immeasurable & residual. The influencing techniques used to govern in religion are so powerful that it was first secularism that adopted such forms of to rule over the masses as it has always done and continues to do.

You hit the nail on the head Jesse - with regard to religion being a stumbling block however I wanted the end of my opening paragraph to dispel the notion of a secular path being any different to that of religion; at least from our perspective. (I do however appreciate your opening the door to other options) At least for myself ... and I feel that Lisa feels the same → Religion and Secularism are very much one and the same. There are many people who have not had our experience and blinded to this conflict. They think not believing in religion somehow has them immune to its controlling effects. That's exactly what rulers want the masses to think.

I don't want to get off topic with pages and pages of text. This context is important though. It touches on how the clinicians takes from the philosophers, how the mystics take the science and how the church takes from the new agers - or in Alan Watts terms ... how the Prickly takes for the Gooy and how the Gooy takes from the Prickly. However each needs the other in order to see coherently. Of course we all see things differently and I don't propose to even see anything at all. I will however link a 2 minute video that I beleive will help.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4vHnM8WPvU

Anyways - I go too deep hey. :) ... but I am connecting the dots where they matter for me and how it is that I choose to see. Lisa still has a lot of bitterness and resentment when it comes to the church - I'm still working on it myself. It's a little ironic as I was for years abused over and over again by the church before meeting Lisa, yet remain more open to spirituality. I think there a few important notes I can share as to why. Lisa's conditions is very taxing on her energy levels which can exacerbate her negative feelings ... then there is the denial factor. By The Way - I go through all these things myself and am not implying anything negative of my wife. This fact I want to make clear. Just sharing my perspective and nothing more - it's just an opinion and as such; open to many faults ... my ego being the biggest of all - It's hard not to let it get in the way when making any kind of point but I am only human. (I just do what I can to be mindful in this respect - don't want to hold back due to judging myself kind of thing ... bla bla & tick tick)

I think my continued openness to the realm of spirituality is a little challenging given how long it took for me to give up Christianity and the effort it took for Lisa to turn me. I beleive my openness is seen as not really having let go of all that which my wife has come to despise. Hmmmmmmm - ("despise" perhaps a little strong as many of the buddhist teachings Lisa is very much open to ... but not the western interpretations - more on that bind later)

Time for a walk - I see if I can follow this line of "thought" when I get back and have more time.

I also agree that there should be no blame and or requirements - yet those traits are well and truly rampant in both religious and secularism.

I pick this back up soon enough.

Religion and Secularism - One and the Same - Which Path To Take? Take none! - life is not a journey! ... that's another insight of Alan Watts (& various others) I think for me it's starting to make sense. Comes down to the concept of experience therefor there are no paths to take. This is why I am always reevaluating - mixing the prickles with the goo and the goo with the prickles. :)

[jessed03]

Don't feel bad about having an ego! The ego has been misrepresented in modern spirituality, I feel. It's been made to play the role of the devil... i.e. the ultimate scapegoat.

The Tibetans have a saying "The ego is that which adds extra to what is." That pretty much means thoughts, desires, beliefs, preferences, ideas, emotions, memories, future planning, imagination are all ego. If you were to theoretically drop your ego, you would be an empty vessel walking through life being blown around like a leaf in the wind. It would be quite peaceful, I image, but dangerous and deeply impractical. You wouldn't be able to socialize with anybody, and there would be no feeling of separation between yourself and the environment. As Terrence McKenna put it, you'd be sitting in a restaurant but wouldn't know what mouth to put food in.

We need an ego to navigate human existence. The only truly egoless beings are newborn babies.

Rather than being bad, the ego is just a survival mechanism. It has its uses otherwise we wouldn't have developed it through our evolution. This is where I feel Watts' biggest shortfall is. He called himself a spiritual entertainer, and I can sometimes see why. He opted for the poetic on occasion instead of talking about the grim reality of our existence. In human form, we were never at one with the universe. That isn't because our egos came and got in the way, it's because the universe has a million one ways to kill us. I imagine early homo sapiens were fairly egoless with their limited cognition, but the ego and a feeling of separation had to develop to keep us safe from natural dangers, predators, other humans, and viruses. I don't disagree we are all one, but that stops being a beautiful thought to me when I realize how blood thirsty and masochistic the universe is. Each being can only survive by taking life from something else -- often in extremely painful ways. It's no surprise humans, with our bigger brains, developed this mental ego program that focused solely on keeping us safe.

Ironically, it's society (which Watts doesn't have much good to say about) that is allowing us the opportunity to explore our psyches. Sure, society is, and has been over the last 3000 years, dysfunctional and needs improving, but the agreement we have with each other not to murder, steal and rape each other means we can explore realms of consciousness our hunter gather ancestors would never have been free enough and safe enough to willingly explore.

In my opinion, the ego is useful. Plus I believe it's impossible to ditch it for good. Lots of meditation, drugs and brain disorders can suppress it, but it's always there.

Whenever somebody looked at a child dying from a disease and said "I have to do something about that", they were using their ego. Whenever a doctor treated a patient's pain, they were utilizing the benefit of the ego. Problem is in most people's cases, the tool is using the man, rather than the man using the tool.

I think the best way to deal with the ego is to build a healthy one, one that can play nicely with other people, one that realizes it isn't running the show. I think the people who want to get rid of the ego are usually the ones who have been hurt badly by it. But when the ego is healthy, you can begin to further your transcendence of it. You can further realize it's not who you are, but is a useful reference point with which to interact with the world. When the ego is healthy, you can manipulate the program, rather than let it run the show.

And at times, you can enjoy those moments when it drops from view, and you get to see life in the present without comment. But only a healthy ego will allow transcendence, imo. A weak one will fight and fight and fight and make life miserable.

[goingtoofast]

Another fabulously provoking post, Ponder! After listening to Alan Watts, I am reminded of a brief thought attributed to Long Pa, I believe, wherein he claimed "To be uncertain is uncomfortable, but to be certain is ridiculous." I identify with the Prickles in that I am desperate to know, unambiguously, to grasp the particles. However, those moments of comfort and security that arise from 'knowing' dissipate immediately, because I precipitously recognize my underlying desperation, every single time! I work like heck to believe in the structure, and work at least as hard to deny the entropy. No wonder I feel lost. Disneyland was really nice, though. Thanks Ponder.

[Ponder]

ZZZZzzzzzz

Here's THE THING ON EGO FOR ME __________________________________________________

I actually function much better when detached like a leaf blowing in the wind. I do understand the danger in as much when I’m out jogging in traffic with noise cancelling ear buds turned up to the max! In my “eagerness” to detach from myself I’ll use a “prickly” sourced download to play beta tunes which help me reach a “gooy “ brain state that then helps me navigate my empty vessel whilst I encompass a wider field. I go from being the leaf to being the wind. I become one with all that surrounds me. However I don't cling to those elements that are negative and distract.

Now of course I cannot always physically sustain such a state through sheer exertion and playing tunes (as much as I try), however I have been doing it long enough to know that separating myself from myself need not make me vulnerable or devoid of cognitive functions. If anything I am more apt in all that I do. Yes it requires much practice in order to sustain such a level of detachment which is why long term dedication is required in order to keep the glass half full and or empty.

The term ego is as much a loaded word to that of god. It’s a relative term dependent on one’s experience and knowledge of self. I’d also add variables such as where and how much one’s candle has burned. In this context each of us will have a different view point pending on which precipice of life we sit. So it is for me, that after a long trail of suicides re close friends and family - and the suffering I still now live with (again all in my perceptions) and see from day to day that I choose to keeps my poetry in the realms of both Disney & Reality.

I don’t think Watt’s (and others like him whatever he is) is skirting around the topic of - the grim reality of existence. I don’t think you can get any more encompassed on such a topic when constantly talking about death. The reality is that our society makes it more grim than it really ought to be. Taking the fear out of it makes things like eating and mingling less of a concern. Living to always be seeking for more ways to stay living is overrated and not really living. It’s a distraction that makes ape like behavior & cave dwelling more appealing. I do not believe ego is more knowledgeable than instinct. I believe it’s more an affliction as Tolle reveals it to be in his book the Power of Now. Sure it can be considered useful (in its most basic function of being aware without the OCD) but it’s more of a burden than anything else. For all our contrasting with primitive cultures, this overrated form of concessions has certainly been something that we advanced humans have been unable to tame.

I don’t buy that any of our advancements or ways of thinking has afforded us any kind of practical insights over those that have come before us. I think just as our egos would have us believe we need a small part of it to thrive, that we are no more kidding ourselves to think primitive cultures were somehow in a lessor position to use their minds. If anything, I see our modern culture as one that has De-evolved when it comes to the art of living.

I hear you about the oneness and where it stops for you Jesse. On that I agree. However – I am finding much healing from attempting to love others regardless of how pathetic and criminal we all seem. It’s extremely hard – I currently make that my purpose. Not getting a job or having to account on some other pretentious and degrading level of existence

Getting tired now – my apologies.


I really appreciate your response and I want to keep mine honest but respectful.


Instinct is enough for me to keep control of my most basic needs. As for wants – this world is primed to pump up our ego as is the prime source that keeps us from healing. I don’t believe people who want to be rid of ego are weak nor have to of been abused. Not everyone needs to suffer in order to see. In fact I think the strongest people are those whom live without the deluded needs and wants. Some of us come into this world with a greater capacity than others – and then some of us with less... something that was not measured with an IQ test thousands of years ago or anything that needed profiling.

I’m all for intuition – I think the message on ego being a requirement is one that comes from ego – yet – know many of us use the ego to be rid of it. I’m down pat with all that. In my reality as I define and redefine whatever ego be … I care less of it as a requirement to navigate in a world as bent as my ego would have me see. I'm all for creating our own realities BUT fear that has been as tainted as all the other terms. - I admit I actually do this a lot in order to survive - but more so to experience what true freedom is.

I am open to learning what work for others – but trialing it for myself - then rewording in terms that feel is on par for me. It’s a practice – an art form – and a lifestyle. After a while those moments start to last longer until such a point that there is no need or want to have to go out and participate in a system devoid of natural instincts - or one that says I need an ego in which to survive. One just goes step by step to where they naturally gravitate rather than just running around like a chook with its head cut off ... wondering when it will have time to meditate and ponder why one even trys. No need for ego and no need to be swallowed up. No need to desire or no need not to desire not to desire.

I really think it comes down to how fast one’s wick is burning and where the candle ends. I’ve burned way too hard and fast to be throwing away what little left I have left. I'm all for being a slow burner.

Having said that though there is much purpose that can be found in a life that really needs no purpose. Again --- all comes down to point of view. It’s not just my kids that need guidance – the world needs all the help it can get. I think the more of us that can get about without any ego at all, yet remain upright, unscathed and not swallowed up as many would have us believe; then mores the hope for those who reach the cross roads where they need to be.

I really don’t think we need an ego in order to rise above that which our lower selves has already suppressed; our natural selves existing in the past buried within a life we are already living. Weak or Strong – Ego’s job is to keep banging the drum. I hear the message on the senseless fighting and care little to use it to be rid of it. The message in acceptance that brings about a dissolving is not something I can at this point adequately explain … but those teaching gel really well deep within me.

Even now with the banging in my head rattling on as I continue to type knowing I have reached my end – yet a relaxed urge takes me over to type as I will – yet will being something else on the equation that our analytic minds seek to conquer by having to quantize and dematerialize every thought is some vain attempt to keep us from finding our higher selves.

I’ll stick with reading in-between the lines and taking neither rejecting or accepting what’s on either side. I will however make the effort to hold well what feels in tune with less resistance and painless existence. That’s about where my candle is at and I expect it will yet burn for some time yet. No reason not create my own escape despite the reality of this human cage.
__________________________________________

Thanks GTF (goingtoofast) - again a very insightful reply. Infinite Regression was part of a reading your comment reminds me off from my mornings reading. More about each time we think we catch ourselves a new set of variable come into play and then the mind does what it does best - tick tick and more tick tick - I think this is where the notion or context of neither accepting or rejecting allows us the space (whilst detached from our incessant mind) keeps us from being swallowed up; or better said keeps us free. :)

You also made me think of more ... I see what comes to mind in the morning.

It been an interesting development in the thread.

Please don't hold back Jesse - I really think its more the terms and that in general despite different views ... we really just want to the same things.

When you have the space and energy ... continue as you "desire." :) I'm still for passion regardless of my twisted views and my own misunderstanding of whatever words.

ZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Those important elements that you point our Jesse with regard to a healthy balance ego ... I will no doubt touch on in other areas and have already done when it comes to having a healthy attitude in ones recovery and living in daily life. I get that. I guess I am rather prickly in my own way whilst yet claiming to be full of goo. :)

Peace Brother - best wishes and all that.

[jessed03]

Oh yeah, you're right about definitions. By ego, I just mean the processes in your brain that help you navigate through the world, like thoughts, emotions, beliefs, memories, ideas, language. I don't mean egotism or greed, which is harmful. Sadly ego become synonymous with egotism, which is a bit sad as they're not really the same thing.

These mental processes are just tools and can be good or bad, depending on how they're used. If you're hungry and see your neighbour eating, the reason you go to the store to get your own food rather than steal his is because of your ego. This mental pattern that we call the ego is aware that such behaviours could cause a fight or get you imprisoned. This illusion you have in your head of yourself, the world and how it works helps you navigate it to the best of your ability. An animal, which doesn't have an ego, would attempt to steal the food. It wouldn't have the power of cognition to rationalize a more effective way of acting.

You'd be totally lost if you were reborn each moment anew. Of course, the trick is to realize the ego is just an illusion the brain uses to understand its surroundings. Don't get attached to it. And cut that illusion down only to what serves you. Unfortunately that's why ego gets a bad rap. People don't realize it's an illusion, become married to symbols and that which is always changing, and become aggressive and miserable.

Practice transcendence, enjoy transcendence, but have a healthy ego to go back to when those moments end, one which doesn't feel the need to compete or destroy, one which thinks, feels and believes peaceful things. Compassion and violence both result from the ego, so it goes to show how broadly this tool can be used!

Don't feel bad about having an ego, man. It has its uses. The challenge for all of us is to trim it down and neutralize the bad bits. Plus you'll never find a truly egoless person, any way. It's impossible to drop it. It just becomes smaller and hides in different places. :)

[Ponder]

Another good breakdown Jesse. Here is one christian point of view that I still find useful: "Be in the world but not of the world" I acknowledge my surroundings through sensory perceptions yet seek not to identify myself as a form of thought. I feel the danger for most today is not being lost to the world but being lost to the mind. I understand the separation of the minds ability to process "thoughts", "emotions", "beliefs", "ideas", and "language" in contrast to that of being self centered. The former typically viewed as ego - and the latter egocentric.

The identification with self is the part of ego that interests me. The relationship between my thoughts and emotions. How does this affect the way I feel, the way I beleive & the way I see? The use of moral or ethical contrasting between people and animals I find moot due to the fact we don't live by natures laws, where as they do. Instead we have identified ourselves as more important and thus created our own set of rules. Animals imo communicate way more effectively because they don't get in the way of themselves as humans so typical do. We allow our own importance to taint our perception of the world of form whereby we take the identifying term given to those creatures that live within it, and degrades it by calling those we don't like - nothing but animals.

Our own importance and the weight we have placed on our ability to reason and think has complicated our world so that what was once considered simple and rational living is now a now more a perpetual state of constant analytic existing. No longer content to ride the waves, we instead seek to conquer the boughs and troughs of both the inner and the outer. It all comes down to that incessant need that our minds tell us is essential to navigating the complex world that it created. I don't see my purpose as much to be reborn in every moment, but more to shatter what's no longer an illusion but more the grim reality of human existence.

I don't consider myself lost at all when separated from such a miserable state. I in fact see myself as free and care less for this so called ability to thinking ones way through a maze of conquered and complex states. Transcendence is yet another illusion with millions lining up to attain some kind of illusionary state. Two books that really highlight the ego trap of this kind of seeking can be well illuminated through:

Self Inquiry - Dawn of the Witness and The End of Suffering - Yogani
Deep Mediation - Pathway to Personal Freedom - Yogani

I feel whatever I feel man - it comes and goes as I seek to no longer seek. To dis - identify with whatever one thinks of self. I'm pretty much done with the illusion of importance point blank.
__________________________________________________ ______________________________

Skype Call - Time for World of Tanks. ;)

Thanks again for helping to further clarify the difference between Ego and Egotism. (http://wikidiff.com/ego/egotism)

Another book which I am yet to fully absorb is A New Earth by Eckhart Tolle (http://www.oplysning.org/uploads/9/1/4/3/9143605/a_new_earth-eckhart_tolle.pdf) Cool - looks like the full book in pdf ... not quite sure but I recommend ripping it while its up ... also just glean what feel right and above all - don't use your thinking mind to reason what it so typically rejects ... just read and don't think.
____________________

Skype Call - Time for World of Tanks. ;)

Jesse - Your awesome dude. I'n this world I am not the full quid ... so please excuse my wandering & random musings (I'm just riding the waves as I see fit - not sure what the next place/topic will be - I am enjoying the ride in this here space with you and the others and I hope despite our difference it is that same with you - in my eyes we are still much the same) ... Your insights go a long way to grounding me.

Thanks.

Dahila ------ are you still with us?????????????????? How are you???????????

[jessed03]

Exactly, man! Once you start identifying with roles and titles and possessions and labels and what not, you've, as Alan Watts said, become a caricature, which is just a cheap representation of you. You've limited yourself and others. You've essentially traded the Grand Canyon for a photograph of it lol.

Actually I should give credit to IS. What I said above was pretty much just a re-harsh of something Marc said ages ago. Something it took me a very long time to understand at a gut level. I found his writing style hard to digest at the time, but the more I reflect on his old posts, the more I see there was a lot of interesting stuff in them. I do miss having him around. I know he was a believer in ESP, so let's see if I can somehow summon him with my mind *concentrates*...

Yeah, I was a tad skeptical of the whole summoning the dead thing, but you never know. I was flicking through a biography of Watts yesterday, and before his death, he told his daughter he'd come back as her red haired daughter. A while later, she did in fact give birth to a red-headed daughter, who on a family gathering raided the wine cellar and picked up a bottle of Alan's favourite drink.

(Here's the book (http://www.filedropper.com/zeneffects--thelifeofalanwatts></div>) if you want to catch a read. It's fairly short, easy going and pretty enjoyable getting a look at the man from those who knew him. Sort of a swapsie for uploading New Earth.)

Enjoy tanks! And hi to D, if you're reading?

[Ponder]

I feel the same about IS - I really hope he is doing well? I should see if I can find his email in my contacts and try to make contact as I am not the best at ESP ... only intuition. LOL ... so I keep telling myself.

I don't want to begin entertaining Alan watts coming back a s a red head --- lmoa digesting that! Good timing for a much needed laugh. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/laughing/red-neck-laughing-smiley-emoticon.gif

You have influenced yet again ... lol - just kidding ... what's the story with the link:
https://c7.staticflickr.com/1/660/31885556606_d6c28ef72f.jpg
Do I just sign up then come back here and click on your link to then find an option to download that book?

Edit -I have security issues trying to load the page to sign up - What is the name of the book your linking J? Srr for the confusion. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/yellow-hd/sorry-look-smiley-emoticon.gif

[jessed03]

Oh dammit, I'm a total novice at using this forum despite having over 7000 posts. I was trying to do what you did and input the link into the text lol.

Anyway, you can find the book here. http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=42829253208523979677

The copy isn't perfect, but it's light reading, so hopefully that's not a problem. It includes a few things I think Watts was a little too embarrassed to include in his own autobiography. I enjoyed getting to get to know him from a slightly different angle.

And yeah, it'd be nice to find out how Marc's doing, if you do have any way to contact him. I guess posting so much wore him out, but it'd be good to have a quick catch up at least.


https://longblogsaboutpracticallyanything.files.wordpress. com/2015/04/mindless-consumerism.jpg?w=640&h=703

[Ponder]

LOL :) Love it.

I can't find his email address :( - Dahila - do you have Marcs email address? Not sure how I lost it. When I clean house I sometimes go overboard and lose a lot of contacts.

I have downloaded the book - Thanks Heaps ... I will for sure go through it once I finish the others I am on. One at a time for me.
______________

On another Note ... do you mind of I pick your brain re online writing courses? Seems there is a log of banter about online creative writing courses being a waste of time? I kind of need direction and motivation and find courses help to give me that. I'd like to hone my whatever skill I already have by writing elsewhere myself. Not sure what my focus will be at this stage. Just working on seeing what options are available to improve upon my style of writing. BB and a few others seem to repeatedly tell my that my writing is hard to understand. That it's hard to tell what my tone is and possibly my format is too unsettling for readers to continue reading?

If this really be the case, then I would like to learn what it is that I need to do so that others reading can better understand what it is that I am trying to say.

So - as one wannabe writer to another well versed like yourself, I am happy to pay for a course, books or whatever and work towards becoming somewhat more coherent. I could do with a new project and I think it would be money well spent because at the end of it, I want have some thing taking up space. I'm quite serious about this. I can afford around $300 + for this new education. :)

What do you think? Any Ideas?

[Ponder]

I've decided to make a quick bedtime post to carry on this train of thought in regards to brushing up on my writing skills. I've developed a lot of bad habits with dots, dashes and outright bad grammar. Hence I've decided to find a basic writing 101 (https://www.universalclass.com/i/course/writing-basics-101.htm?gclid=CL_WvoPfltECFQp_vQod2uMJ2w) course before focusing on what kind of writing I'd like to do. I don't propose the one I've linked to be a good choice or not. I'm sure there are a lot of scams out there waiting to take advantage of those that struggle to read and write. I'll have to be careful and review any courses that requires money before making any kind of transaction.

Whilst in today's world there is a wide variety of open source options available, I find the structure of most courses difficult to follow and the locating of qualtiy programs an even harder prospect. Although I am an avid proponent of free information, I do on occasion find paying for the odd book quickly saves me time in acquiring top quality information. So it is that I hope to find an effective online course in basic writing skills for a reasonable price. Given as previously mentioned that paid courses can also be shams, I'd appreciate any feedback on how to go about sourcing reputable online courses.

Does English Composition sound like a good 101 course? I'm just concerned I might end up doing a primary school level course for immigrants aiming to learn english. Whilst I want to learn grammar once more and pick up all that I missed early on, I'm also wanting to learn more about structure and the many other variables that make the written word much easier to read and write. I was hoping if or when you had the time, you might consider helping to steer me in the right direction. I understand if you're snowed under or just want to give thinking a break. In your own time of course. At anyrate, am sure I will work it out.

As long as I am able to source a legitimate program, Lisa does not mind me spending money towards a writing course. Lisa feels there is nothing wrong with my grammar, but the truth in that is she does not read my posts. In addition to understanding nouns, pronouns, adjectives and how to properly use them, I also struggle with the basics of knowing when to use a comma and when not to. I'm also pulling at my hair over things like to and too. The list goes on.

So once I brush up on the basics I guess I will need to pick the type of writing I wish to embark on. I really don't think content is going to be a problem for me, despite my ADHD. This is why I want to get some kind of structure and routine happening and hence my yearning to do a couple of courses. For so long I have harped on about wanting to do a Blog. I know that in itself has become a specialty; a style of its own. I have already been freestyling with various online journals all on the web few a number of years now and whilst that's been a big help in a number of areas It's all the more reason I need to define my purpose and where I shall write.

The Self Help genre is pretty much my thing. There's no denying that. Weaving all that I have learned and translating it into more simplified terms is a common aim for most recovering individuals like myself. Learning to write from the soul yet in some kind of structured form to an intended audience sounds like a mission. I think I will use a blog or webpage of some kind to layout ideas for a book. That's three different formats but knowing how I want to go about will surely help.

For now I will focus on finding a reputable basis writing 101 course. Perhaps one on English Composition? I'm staying well clear of the million and one creative writing courses for now. I think I agree with the many opinions on the web that those courses are akin to minefields. Something to consider for later.

Well folks, that another diary entry done for the night. I figure I have some direction now and a better idea of what I'd like to do.

I hope this finds you all well.

Good Morning and; Good Night. ZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[jessed03]

Ah, that's a shame about Marc. I can respect his need for space from this place though. There have been times I've needed to take time away and recharge. Hopefully he pops in again soon.

I'm glad to hear you're taking an interest in writing, dude! Language is so important to us hooomans, so it's nice to have a little control over it -- express ideas in easy to grasp ways and stuff.

Grammar is deffo the best place to begin. Boring, but essential. Having confidence in your ability to string together elements of texts in the correct way sort of opens you up. It releases those inhibitions meaning creativity can just flow out.

Then you want a quick touch up on writing style. This just helps you write effectively. You can organize your words in the most meaningful and fluid way. Sort of like good manners for text, really.

Then you have a good base to work on composition, which is basically just learning about how to create all different types of writing pieces (articles, essays, stories, poems, blog posts, etc etc.)

Grammar and style can be learned from books. It's not the most fun topic, but it'll always be with you once you've learned it. Composition is probably best learned with other people as at this point in the writing journey you want to have others read your work and give you feedback so you can keep developing. But, I guess you could still learn from a good book and just get other folks on the web to give you feedback. Depends on how you feel about sharing your work and your goals.

I hope that process doesn't sound overwhelming. Each of us has already mastered like 80% of this whole writing business, so it's really only a case of polishing things up.

[Dahila]

Marc is happy and well, his personal life took off beautifully, I do not think he wants to keep in touch I have his address though, and every 6 month or so we exchange a short notes ;)) I am not sure he wants to keep in touch with people ............I mean with us

[jessed03]

Oh, thanks for the update Dahls. As long as he's happy.

Who could blame him for not wanting to hang out with us crazies, eh! ;)


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/b8/c4/f0/b8c4f0155af85238904038e574b498d1.jpg

[Ponder]

Hi Dahila. Thanks for letting us know how Marc is. I think Jesse's assessment is spot on. :)

Thank for the confirmation J. Lisa is being quite supportive with me doing an online course. I'm looking into this one atm:

Efficient Writing AWR102
(https://adlonlinecourses.com/index.php?route=product/pdf&product_id=1099)
I've decided I'm going to go a course with a minimum of 100 hours. I think I would really benefit from a structured course with professional tuition.

My research thus far tells me that ADL seem to be a legit organization. I'm not going to dive in anytime soon as my eBay auctions still have several days before they end. I'm looking to stick with the UK as I don't want to get stuck with American English. :) The Australian Courses that I can find seem to be an copy of the UK but charging hundreds more. The cost of education has skyrocketed in our country. What used to be subsidised in no longer the case and the fees are outlandish for anyone unemployed. Thankfully I have a few things left to sell.
__________________________

I have a huge day today. Hope this finds you all well.

Thanks again for your help. It was good to hear from you Dahila.

Until next time. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Ponder]

Hey Guys, hope your all doing well! With Lisa's help I have finally decided and enrolled in a writing course. We could not justify the high prices for a starter/refresher/beginners course that will inevitably lead into more courses. Therefore we opted to go with edX (https://www.edx.org/about-us). edX is a web based platform founded by Harvard University and MIT in 2012 where Universities from all over the world outreach from. Many of the courses are free whereby you have full access to course materials and tuition, but on completion and passing you forego certification. Whilst not certified, your as every bit educated!

Our 48 hour + researching campaign with regard to the best online educational programming has at this point resulted with edX at the top of our list. The course syllabus looks very well structured and includes everything that I was looking for in an Essential Writing Program. I found the course syllabus of other online courses lacked information (even those charging hundreds of dollars) for likewise beginner/refresher courses. In addition the to this, many charging competitors that had cooling off periods; expired before the course even begins. So it is with the lack of information and shoddy marketing claims of the other competitors that we ended up choosing edX.

Here's the course I ended enrolling in: (Starts - Feb 27, 2017)

English Grammar and Style (https://www.edx.org/course/english-grammar-style-uqx-write101x-3#!)

I'll spotlight the video they are using to introduce this course. It's only TWO MINUTES and "hits the nail on the head at the 50 Second Mark" (and onwards) as to why I am doing this course.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhs3XHx3_iA

My inherent passion for self expression and to that inspiration I well received from those warm spirited teachers during my chaotic schooling years; has me chomping at the bit whilst I await the above course's starting date! For the most part my english and science teachers were typically nice to me. Its was commonly the maths teachers that belted me and made my life a living hell. Of course I'm discounting many of the disgruntled primary school teachers to which my then predisposition had me often seen as an atypical case for the targeting. Then of course there was those religious ones!
_______________________________________



The only other Source Material I am currently using is an old purchase I made a long time ago:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/285/31822197032_033c9b26ce_n.jpg (https://www.amazon.com/English-Grammar-Dummies-Geraldine-Woods/dp/0470546646)
. Full PDF available here → CLICK (https://english4u.com.vn/Uploads/files/English%20Grammar%20for%20Dummies.pdf)

The dummies guides usually get a bad wrap, however after a quick skim I have to say this book is both inspiring and informative for my level of comprehension. It certainly has a lot of positive reviews on Amazon. What matters most is that it seems to fit the bill for me.

I dare say after digesting this book and on completion of that above course, that I will have a much better idea of what writing style I'd like to adopt as well as knowing what following course will better suit. That way if I do invest with money; it will be well spent.

So that's it. I accomplished my latest goal and now it's time to start practising with this here text! I shall see how many times I can actually do a full and clean edit; before I randomly hit - submit! :)
___________

PS- I know reading can be a chore Jesse. If and when you do read this post, would you be kind enough to please advice if you were able to easily read?
Thank You.

[Ponder]

I'll link this post Jesse, because I am interested in what you might think. Your of Millennial age are you not?

Millennials in the Workplace & Digital Addiction - Phones, Facebook & Social Media (http://anxietyforum.net/forum/showthread.php?35915-Millennials-in-the-Workplace-amp-Digital-Addiction-Phones-Facebook-amp-Social-Media&p=235516#post235516)

At any rate I hope this finds you well.

I'm heading in for a game of World of Tanks. I hope the economy does not crash as a result. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/happy/rolling-on-the-floor-laughing-smiley-emoticon.gif

[Ponder]

Just freestyling this morning post. I'm back to lapping the oval and sweating once more after having put on approx 5kgs over christmas and doing a hell of a lot less. At my age, my body type and my abusive chemical history (both prescription and illicit) it does not take long for my body to put on weight when not watching what I eat and or sitting for long periods of time. You would not think 5kg is much, but let me tell you when you've crawled your way back to the land of health from morbidly obese; It's a LOT!

I've even avoided going back to the gym simply because of the change in the way I look. That there is a problem in itself. Nonetheless I am committed once again and feeling good that I have not let myself chronically slip. That is to say I have caught myself within a range that's not to peaking with ups and downs. Well no more the 5kgs worth. ... lol

I'll look online and or possibly in the local pawn shop today for a set up dumbbells and a bench. I'm still adamant about working towards becoming independent so as not having to rely on the gym. Keeping active is very important to me and since labouring work is not what it used to be; creating my own activity program - gives me all the purpose I need. I've become so disenchanted with society that I am unable to hold down a job. It really is as simple as that. Thankfully I have learned how to live without the need to be constantly gratified and happy. Once the penny drops it's easy and quite liberating to no longer bother, with societal standards. Happy is not what it's cracked up to be. But that's another long story. I'm all for being content, but within a reality that includes everyone else; one that does not blind me to what's really going on. I'm not into prescribing a happiness and long life based on some J-O-B within a value system that I feel is responsible for the despair that many of these would be self-help motivational gurus single out in other groups. As individuals, we really should not be placing that much weight on our importance.

For me I think it goes something like that. I figured my previous post linking that capitalist spin on "Millennials In The Workplace" would not get much attention in here. Was worth a try I guess. I really was interested in hearing how those in that age range felt about whatever it was they may have been able to glean. Especially those struggling in this Anxiety Forum

The part of most interested me was - hmmmm ... I thought about it when out lapping this morning ... arr yes!

Digital Addictions Destroying Lives Through Destabilised Relationships.

Now that was something worth focusing on amongst all the other static I was hearing within that above vid. BUT - it is time for me to balance out other stuff within my own realm here in this other side. :)

I'll go do some of that balancing now and when time allows, I'll pick up that freshly made title and run with that. I know for sure that the dreaded smartphone coming into our bed has made for a huge wedge!

Adios - Until Next Post. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/travel/train-goodbye-smiley-emoticon.gif

[Dahila]

I am so sorry D. My daughter came with the small one to eat pierogies, and I had done a tarot reading for her, it was very good finally. We have this tradition that i read month by month and she takes notes. On the end of year we look into notes;) it is fun to do it with own daughter:) I love the train

[Ponder]

I totally understand. That's awesome about teaching your gift Dahila. You made me smile big time when I read your saying so. :)

[Dahila]

no no , it is not this way. She takes notes when I do reading for whole year. Each month has a different message. No one can remember so notes are good idea. Many people put notes when I do reading.
She was using tarot but she claims it does not let her tell a story. Reading tarot cards is like reading a book . Nothing more;)) She got good reading that's all. For many years I could not tell her anything optimistic, and I kept saying; your time and happiness will come, you must wait, really it was difficult not to see anything good coming her way. Finally her life is changing and she goes in right direction. Awesome ;))
She is to smart to want this gift, The gift brings a lot of anxiety :(

[Ponder]

Arrr - I see what you mean about the notes now. I once tried reading up on what and how one opens the door to such an art. Can it be called an art? I wonder now if gift was the right word as well? I can tell from our previous conversation on the topic that you are quite well versed in it.

Not much feeling like thinking too much today. I have a few ideas but will keep those to myself. For now at least :) - My spinach patch is still going well, although struggles during the day with our extreme heat. Summer has been very hot of late with many news stories and new record breaking days. The Chard wilts for most of the day; even when it's comes time to cut for dinner. What works really well is cutting the leaves in the early morning, bringing inside, giving them a rinse than putting the leaves into a container of water. The air conditioning inside the house gives them a reprieve temperature wise. I picked a large bunch so left a few leaves for a second day in a row and to my surprise they are still very fresh!

I'm not sure if this method would work as well for store bought ones, but it's an awesome tip if your growing this kind of spinach (Swiss Chard) in extreme heat:


________


Swiss Chard - Two days in container on kitchen bench and still Fresh!!! (change water and give a spray)

https://c7.staticflickr.com/1/750/31176768694_ba90dca48a_o.jpg

The foreground is my breakfast - Home made prune juice. I'm back to eating clean - no probs. ;) Giving the Oats a break - they seem to lead me aff track. So it is for me. Maybe just have twice a week as a treat.

[Ponder]

This is something I have been thinking about today. Getting late here for me so expect some typos. Addictions and Attachments, their relationships and so on; they do seem to go hand in hand.

https://insidethealcoholicbrain.com/2014/11/28/is-addiction-an-attachment-disorder/comment-page-1/#comment-4846 (https://insidethealcoholicbrain.com/2014/11/28/is-addiction-an-attachment-disorder/comment-page-1/#comment-4846)

which I then ended up at this one:

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/mind-guest-blog/the-emotional-blindness-of-alexithymia/

Although the last one very brief - it's quite relevant to one of my family members with a history of self harm + myself and many more us!

I'll quote the following from the first link that really struck me. Not only for my own kids, and all kids in general from maladjusted environments - but for myself as well.

The emotional pain and terror are so intense, the child will do anything to distract itself from those screaming needs. “In this distress I can only comfort myself in ways that are often maladaptive – I may bite myself, I may rock myself perpetually, trying to distract myself from my needs,” Dr. Siegel states. Such children “have all sorts of self-regulatory processes that are not interpersonal. They are very isolated.”

Perhaps out of context from article, but I just want to say regarding that quote → "This is why I don't condone today's great shift for parents to teach their kids to self sooth. That's a very sad act for professionals to be endorsing.":(
_________________________________

Whilst the article is specific to alcoholism - I'm looking into the relationship of addictions across the whole spectrum.

More to the point, I'm looking into how Society plays the larger role in being the neglecting caregiver that gives birth to said "Insecure Attachments." Go figure hey.

Nonetheless it pays to learn how these things tick. It makes the process of building new bridges much easier and surprisingly also makes us more independent than some enterprising individuals/business/corporations and or would be professionals would dare claim. That is to say the need for ongoing validation and deep emotional connections is not the necessity they claim it to be. In fact - AA itself often becomes an ongoing attachment that results in it's own addiction. HMMM YEA ... good point to finish on. I know such things for fact through lived experience. This is where my take on attachment deviates from that proposed in linked article and whereby I see mine as less clinical and more philosophical with an eastern twist.

Night Night ... ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzz

[Dahila]

Tell me about chard, it is a good veggie, dark leaves probably minimal number of carbs;))

[Ponder]

Sorry D, I got side track my apologies. I get around to this later. :)

OK OK Jesse ... we need some form of Balanced Ego ... Please Come Back :(

[Ponder]

Morning Walk Done:

This is me taking a moment at the halfway point of my hour long walk.

https://c5.staticflickr.com/1/482/32023852396_bb4c13a804_b.jpg (https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/482/32023852396_9d4a7f788a_o.jpg)

[jessed03]

What's your current exercise regime like, Dave? Is it mostly made up of walking?

Must be good for the soul out there. :)

[Ponder]

Hey Jesse! Thanks for popping back in. :) :) :) Firstly a BIG thanks for helping clarify my understanding of ego! That was an awesome discussion and helped me helps. TY

OK - My Exercise Regime. Geeeeezzzz Just thinking about. Sigh. LOL

I've been trying to demilitarise it of late yet retain some form of discipline.

This morning I am tired but know I will benefit from a gentle run. I look outside to be greeted with a cooler and overcast day. What a relief ... it's been scorching hot here of late. There is however some rain in it so I might go show up at the gym and hit the treadmill. I don't like the gym anymore. I perform and feel so much better outdoors.

I've reverted to using bodyweight at home with a power twister. I do push ups with hand grips , tricep dips using the back of a chair, then a number of exercises using my power twister. That's it atm as far as upper body. I'm looking to fine tune my home exercise routine into becoming a full body workout by doing bodyweight/dumbbell/light weighted squats variants and the implementation of resistance bands. I have a spring chest expander on watch [eBay] as well as the pre mentioned resistance bands. To finish it all off I will most likely get myself a flat dumbbell bench (not bulky barbell one) that can do both decline and incline. (maybe a door way chin up bar as well)

My focus is only having enough equipment to take up a small corner of a room when not in use.

Right now I still walk a LOT and glad I have kept it that way. My biggest issue with health has been the HEAT. I have still not acclimated to the humidity and the extreme temps. Temperatures still climb from year to year. The factor in that has been taking some toll in my sleep and having an impact on cortisol levels. I am also super sensitive to Lisa's decline/ups and downs ... but gradual decline ... Still on the cards to fully set up my own room. Energy tranfesrance is a factor in my health but that's another story and off track. Srry.

Ummmm ---------- I go now as the rain is more like drizzle and I prefer to run in it than the gym. I can smell the clean air in the rain and it feels good. I have aqua buds that play some vibes that help keep me in sync ... to use buds or not ... is something else I often struggle with. Pros and cons to constantly driving the mind - motivating and whatnot ... I like to vary my drive between pushing and meditation whilst engaging in whatever form of movement. Sitting down is not good!!! But I also like to work on using my mind despite it's apparent faults. LOL
___________________

Thanks for the question. It's easy not do anything the older we get ... or at any age I guess. I'm keeping myself in check minus the up and down 5kb variable. Definitely some cortisol issues going on at the moment, but watching what I eat and keeping myself moving is crucial to my ongoing state of mind.


___________
On another note* I have started a website where I can do more of my "polished" writing. For now it's called Self Help Central (unpublished) - it's just a predraft is all. Still fleshing it all out.

That's about all for now.

I hope you and yours are well.

Thanks again for popping back in. Please keep in touch as I'd like to show you this new project I am working on. I'll link it in PM once I feel there is enough for you to get an idea where it's heading and in fact would be very open to any guidance you could give. I'm going to put a few $$$ into it later on. I've never done that before - but feel it's a good place to teach myself on a more professional level ... or one that can have more of an impact ... purpose and all that.

Adios ... until next post. ;)

[Ponder]

On second thoughts, I'm not going to fuss over the dumbbells and bench. Less is best. Left the earbuds at home and had a pretty good session doing laps on the hockey oval.

[jessed03]

You're welcome. It's nice to be able to hash out ideas in here. I'm sure I'm just like you. We read a few books, watch a few vids, then it becomes a case of digesting the content and trying to take the good stuff while discarding the dogma.

I don't have anyone to talk about this stuff with in real life, so really appreciate you letting me share this space! A few days ago I was having a moment of nostalgia in here. I was remembering many of the guys who have passed through... John, Cully, Tailspin, Dorrie, Frankie, Pam, Marc, etc. I've really taken a lot from the convos that have taken place in here.

Sounds like you've got a pretty comprehensive workout plan there. Certainly don't envy you with that heat though! Is everything A/C over there or do you have to rely on fans and stuff? How does Lisa find the heat?

[jessed03]

P.s. Yeah, not bad myself. Trying to fit back into a rhythm again. Sleep, diet, exercise and meditation all got out of sync what with Xmas and the OCD-period. I'm in the middle of reading Mindfulness in Plain English. I've never read it before, but I know Jon K Z speaks highly of it.

[Ponder]

AC is surely sapping the planet dry. LOL Yea man ... everyone has it going now. Or at least those that can afford it. Lisa suffers greatly without it. In fact there is a subsidy that we receive for it due to her illness. It's not much, but we are grateful for it.

I remember most of those names you mention. Ineed ... some extremely insightful discussions with those individuals. You're right; much of that info wells still wells within. I miss them very much.

YEA - I find the hype not worth the destabilization during the end of year period. It takes quite some composing to remain in sync with all the upheaval. Good point actually ... about the change in cultural seasons. Hmmm Yea.
___________________________________

Nice looking book. Does this look like it and is this the full version?

This version has Jon Kabat-Zin names on the top of cover - However I don't think as the Author? The file name and web address has the word " Preview" in it. I wonder is this the full version of the book. 208pgs as listed from chapter one. ???
http://www.wisdompubs.org/sites/default/files/preview/Mindfulness%20in%20Plain%20English%20Book%20Previe w.

Here is the other one I found: I think it is full version as the other only goes to chapter 13 and missing all the others?
http://misc.equanimity.info/downloads/mindfulness_in_plain_english.pdf

Anyways I downloaded both. I think it's good to go back to plain english. LOL - I think Watts has left me with a little headache. :) More the way I have delved into things of late. I've been deep into another book myself and I think it's more the combination of me sucking up all this info with my text to speech. I really need to practice more reading in front of my screen. : )
______________



__

This is the latest I have been reading:
Quest for Spiritual Self-Reliance: Movement of Meditation
(https://www.amazon.com/Quest-Spiritual-Self-Reliance-Movement-Meditation/dp/1507859171)
Here is a quote that relates to our conversation not so long ago:
Ego thinks that it can avoid death, and that is how it all starts…the fight is on….
— Martin Esten

Here is the Contents List: PS - THIS IS YET ANOTHER AWESOME BOOK FOR ONLY A FEW $$$ !!!

CONTENTS

INTRODUCTION

CHAPTER ONE: Meditation on Thinking

The Origin of Dysfunction in the Human Species ["lol nice intro to chapter one I thought ... hehe"]

Presumption of Problems

Psychological Build up

Illusory Need for Prevention

Primordial Pain

Major Building Blocks of Dysfunction

Mind Means Well

There is no Spiritual Thinking

Time and Thought

Impermanent Thought Will Never Accept Impermanence

Thought is Always Old, Awareness is Always New

Creation of the Thinker

Pleasure Principle

Karma Determinism (Destiny)

To Cherish Thoughts

No Need to Learn More

Creativity

Transition from Awareness to Thought

Trust That Silence

Self-Centeredness

We Are Simply Just Not Interested

Key on the Quality of Thought

Use of Mind


CHAPTER TWO: Meditation in Images

The Basic Restriction

Forming of Images

The Need for Conflict

Illusory Separation

Who Gets Hurt and Who Gets Flattered?

The Need to “Be” Someone

Bumper Sticker

Images of God

Returning Home Is to Drop All Images

CHAPTER THREE: Meditation on the Little “Me”

Reactivity

Who is Judge/Observer?

Suffering needs the Little “me” and Its Story

Language

Little “me” and the Universe

CHAPTER FOUR: Meditation on Struggle as Opportunity

Struggle as Blessing

Fear

Psychological Problems and Disorders

Conflict Situations

Criticizing “Others”

Colored Perceptions

To Wish Ill

Conditioned to be Unhappy


CHAPTER FIVE: Meditation on Sin, Hell, Cause, It

No Rewards and no Punishments

To Sin

It

CHAPTER SIX: Meditation on Meditation

Meditation is the Most Natural “Thing”

Ego Wants to Own Meditation

Happiness is Only a Byproduct

Not a Twenty Minutes Exercise

No Practice

Spiritual Pretenders

Spiritual Supermarket of the West

Developing Dependence


CHAPTER SEVEN: Meditation on Religion

Time to Move on

Surrender

Believer vs Atheist

To Follow Spiritual Authority

No Differences

Description and Reality are Two Different Things

Requiem for Fairness

Letting Go


CHAPTER EIGHT: Meditation on Outside “Security”

“A Better Life”

Inner Adjustment

To Have More

Inviting Insecurity and Opposites

CHAPTER NINE: Meditation on Escapes

Too Much Noise

Ego Has Spilled in all Social Media

Desire and Fear; Pull and Push; Pleasure and Pain

Love

Hope


CHAPTER TEN: Meditation on Relative vs. Absolute Truth

Need to Specify

Different Approaches to Truth by Different People; Same Results (For Spiritually “Advanced”)

Everything is Watched

You Cannot Bring It About

A Different Kind of Intelligence is Needed

CHAPTER ELEVEN: Meditation on Awareness

Suicide

Nothing is Required

Be Vigilant

Tasting the First Freedom

Making “It” More Solid

Keep it Clean and Healthy

Coming Back Home to Fairness

The Only Question

Learn How to Fly
__________________________________________________ _____________________________________
I will read the one you have just listed next. But I cheat using Text to Speech. Just kidding ... I am having a quick read now, but have promised myself to take more time in being more mindful when reading these books. :)

[Ponder]

Currently I am working on my own article called "The Medication Trap" I aim to make it my most balanced post. Nothing like picking a sensitive topic to practice mindfulness. :)

[Ponder]

I came across the following conclusion that summed things up well for me whilst researching the epidemic of increased numbers of the mental ill.

The Epidemic of Mental Illness: Why? (http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/06/23/epidemic-mental-illness-why/)
Marcia Angell JUNE 23, 2011 ISSUE (http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/06/23/epidemic-mental-illness-why/)

Imagine that a virus suddenly appears in our society that makes people sleep twelve, fourteen hours a day. Those infected with it move about somewhat slowly and seem emotionally disengaged. Many gain huge amounts of weight—twenty, forty, sixty, and even one hundred pounds. Often their blood sugar levels soar, and so do their cholesterol levels. A number of those struck by the mysterious illness—including young children and teenagers—become diabetic in fairly short order…. The federal government gives hundreds of millions of dollars to scientists at the best universities to decipher the inner workings of this virus, and they report that the reason it causes such global dysfunction is that it blocks a multitude of neurotransmitter receptors in the brain—dopaminergic, serotonergic, muscarinic, adrenergic, and histaminergic. All of those neuronal pathways in the brain are compromised. Meanwhile, MRI studies find that over a period of several years, the virus shrinks the cerebral cortex, and this shrinkage is tied to cognitive decline. A terrified public clamors for a cure.

Now such an illness has in fact hit millions of American children and adults. We have just described the effects of Eli Lilly’s best-selling antipsychotic, Zyprexa.

If psychoactive drugs are useless, as Kirsch believes about antidepressants, or worse than useless, as Whitaker believes, why are they so widely prescribed by psychiatrists and regarded by the public and the profession as something akin to wonder drugs? Why is the current against which Kirsch and Whitaker and, as we will see, Carlat are swimming so powerful? I discuss these questions in Part II of this review.

—This is the first part of a two-part article.

Letters (http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/08/18/illusions-psychiatry-exchange/)
'The Illusions of Psychiatry': An Exchange July 28, 2011 (http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/08/18/illusions-psychiatry-exchange/)

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ______


A special thanks to those forum users whom without I would not have such a passion for posting on medication. TY

[Ponder]

This from article two:

Even Robert Whitaker, in his Anatomy of an Epidemic, concedes that these drugs are effective in the short term—it is the potential long-term effects that he discusses. Whitaker makes the argument that used long-term, all psychiatric drugs are essentially poisonous to the brain and have led directly to skyrocketing rates of psychiatric disability. While his arguments are intriguing, I agree with Dr. Angell that there are significant weaknesses in the evidence he marshals.

I'm here to say I'm on a disability pension for mental illness and can unequivocally say the long term effects of both antipsychotics and antidepressants really fucked me up even more! How about we grab a few of these docs and force them to comply by making them take these meds for years running and go through all the weight gain, ensuing medical complications, memory loss, intrusive thoughts and bla bla bla ...

I wonder if it would then be so intriguing?

[jessed03]

I've never seen that book before. Thanks for the share. Just read the author's bio and it says he's not affiliated with any religion or spiritual movement. I do like reading about spirituality from a neutral's perspective. Forget all the dogma and old tradition, just take a look inside yourself. Explore a little. Pull back the curtain of the mind, so to speak.

I've added it to my read list. :)

Looking forward to your article too, man. If we were playing side effect bingo, I'd also be able to cross off intrusive thoughts, weight gain, blood sugar problems, etcetera.

Dahlia, do you take anti-depressants, or do you just use benzos when needed?

[Dahila]

Jesse only clonazepam as needed :)
Lemon balm extract, white tea, Low carbs, high fat diet, helps me too, I am much calmer now :)

[Ponder]

That's really great to hear Dahila. I wish I could say I am a lot calmer now. :) Lisa is going seems to be going through a massive wave of depression. Whilst I am responsible for my own thoughts and actions, I got to say that when living in close proximity of negative energy, it really sucks! Literally so. Like a gravity well. Sometimes I feel like I am pumping up a tire with a hole in it. No matter how much I try to keep spirited I always end up deflated. :( I mean not to blame my partner, just making an observation. It's like I start to feel guilty if I am not feeling as depressed. Encouragement is non existent and in fact the negative energy seems to feed of my own attempts to prop myself back up. I am exhausted on such a front - Therefore I try not to resist as is the zen way, but try as I may ... well ... I actually play role of depression quite well myself. When I give up - I give up. Meh & Sigggggghhhhhhhhhhhh ...

BUT - I shall rise and push myself until my heart stops. :) Fuck it. I can swear and sound like a dirty pig and give a bit of shock and awe like whatever the fuck that filthy fucking video I cam across. Made me feel like resorting to posting the old way I once did. Hey ... Fucking CUNTS!!!! - How about I revert to my Old Fucking Ways and start treating every like a fucking PRICKS & SLUTS!!! ... How about that you Filthy Fucking Cunts!!! Hey ... you won't a piece of that. You want a giant Black African Cock to split you all the way ... deep, deep OH fucking DEEP. WTF is that shit about???

Hmmm - Yea ... Like that's real helpful???? What kind of language is that? ..... More fucking riddles?
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ______

So where was I. Think I will hit enter on that point!

[Ponder]

So anyways ... I'll hit Enter Once more and recompose myself. WTF was that shit???? What was the fucking point ... in fact I don't want to know any more ... I go back and delete my question re that fucking vid. BRB

[Ponder]

This is what I "WAS" working on:

http://dmkynaston2.wixsite.com/selfhelpcentral

Somehow I feel like I am wasting my time.

I'm off for a run.

PS - I don't think I can write an article ... I can try though. I certainly don't want to resort to talking trash. That never helps. It only makes thing worse.

I'm off in search of a heart attack whilst out lapping. Perhaps I will make more sense when I get back. I really should not of strayed from under this rock! As far as that goes in this place ... I give up! Won't be happening any more. If anything, I am more dedicated to leaving this place than ever before.

[Ponder]

Actually Before I pop out the door all toxic and like, perhaps you can help me get my head around approaching a writing style Jesse.

The truth is I want to start my own forum as well as create an online place where I can link relevant information (re my attempts at with proposed webiste linked above)

The forum Idea I have toyed with before, but never spent money on it. Since I have now stopped wasting my money of "things" and just sold more "Stuff" I now have more than enough $$$ in the bank to dedicate to my dream.

I think the reason a lot of those name you mentioned before moved on, is whilst the term Anxiety attracts, there is much lacking for staying power when it comes to continued healing. The influx of deluded children combined with the medication subsection only feeds the problem. Well - that's been talked about before more than once. Others have repeatedly told me they don't why they are still here and in fact it's more each other that we so reason.

ANYWAYS - my level of activity here only helps this place to further exist.

OH YEA! - Writing Style ... hmmmmm. Does not matter. I'll work it out. I think I needed more to get this other "stuff" off my chest. Too much denial in this forum. Yea. That's it! The reason I am not liked outside of this little space when venturing into other parts of this forum is because of the paths I choose to take. So it is that I need to clearly define and accept that any kind of other place I intend to create shall be no larger than the eye of a needle. lol at the uses of such analogy. Perhaps I will slap a fish sticker on the banner and compromise like hell just to get the hits.

We're all good at whining, but do little when it comes to the crunch. So it is that I was again make such a proposal to myself. If at first I don't succeed, then try again.

Yep ... now the lactic acid has settled ... now I'll go for my run. Think more on this new direction - yet again. ;)

[Ponder]

I guess it's true ... the only one you can count on in this world; is yourself.

[Dahila]

Hey D. I have no idea what happened, I had not been here whole day , I am doing a lot of research lately about skin:)

[Ponder]

Is ok Dahila ... thankyou ... I had a bad reaction to a well meaning post. ... I went to the gym and about broke one of their treadmills. :) I talk more later as I feel I need to. But have some stuff to do first.

TY for popping in. Just going through a destabilizing period.

~Dave.

[Ponder]

Yea, I don't like Vulgarity like that. Now you know why I chose to cheapen it with the above. I don't want to mix with people that like that kind of thing. It's on par with racism and abuse like behaviour. If people want to start posting more of that kind of garbage, I will just join in and take it to the extreme. It's how I operate in society. Law enforcement and other forms of authority also do that same thing. It's insanity to pretend to be one way and then live another. Definitely reevaluating my friends list.
__________________________________________

Time for to bust a move for the afternoon. Nothing vulgar of course.

[Ponder]

__________________________________________________ ___________

Die Cast Weights Are Overrated :p

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x30/davekyn/Best-Suspension-Trainers-Top-10-Suspension-Training-Equipment_zpssamyobk1.png

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x30/davekyn/Resistance-Bands-Exercises_zpsqirj2asa.png

I ended up opting for a suspension system and resistance bands with a swiss ball for my home workouts. The suspension system is modeled on the overpriced TRX but miles cheaper. I can do all the same workout so happy with that. For the resistance bands I decided to pay for a premium set - "Bodylastics." [also got a couple of Thera/Loop Bands too] Additionally I ordered a couple of spring loaded chest expanders.

The suspension training and resistance bands looks really good! I can't beleive the number of exercises that can be done with these systems. I really have been under a rock for a loooong time. Loads of Guides online and I even got a DVD and booklets with each system I bought. I'm even keen to get into doing core workouts with the swiss ball. I got a few extras to complement the system but won't go into all that. Basically I just bought myself a home gym for about 130 British Pounds and it weighs less the 5kg tops. The swiss ball blown up will probably take up more space. lol. I'm done lugging around heavy weights. [although I still have my exercise Sandbag that I think I will keep - will look into some HIIT routines for that] I think my body will do so much better with body resistance and negative weight training. I'm betting on it. : )

NO MORE GYMS!!!! and BS contracts. AWESOME!

I still can't get over the number of exercises from the suspension system alone:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBrBjpOa5rc&list=PLKogtgZbxilvnHX5Y4jj1XmXDkJu4A9Lv

.... & the resistance bands with accessories is as good as having my own cable system.

Fully motivated once again!!!
___________

Much better for my shoulder as well. On that note, I now have what I need for Rotator Cuff Therapy. Bugger spending money on doctors and destroying my joints with die cast weights. Although a heart attack this morning would of been welcomed. Just kidding.

Iv'e almost dropped that 5kg gain running into Xmas. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/happy/happy.gif

[Dahila]

yeah it is fantastic, my daughter BF introduced it to me, it is easy to use and has a lot of option. They work out 2 times a week in gym, I think running and at least 3 times a week with the same thing as you got. I tried to do butterlfy on it it is tough

[Ponder]

Morning Laps done! http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/yes/winking-thumbs-up-smiley-emoticon.gif - Time to do the dishes - doing the dishes is tough. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/housework/washing-dishes-smiley-emoticon.gif

Today I work on keeping my spirits high. Got some $$$ from selling more "STUFF!" so will buy Lisa something she likes.

Thanks again for popping in when I was derailing D. Much appreciated.

I'll check FB later ... after I get my head together and of course; when the dishes done. :)

[Ponder]

Try not to laugh but I'm looking for forums to vacate to once again. :)

[Dahila]

I would not care about other's D, stay here, no one comes here:)

[jessed03]

Those bands look cool. A had a similar set ages ago and really liked them.

Apologies if I contributed a little to your derailment, by the way. I wouldn't have joked around if I knew how strongly you felt about vulgarity. I've had so many horrific intrusive thoughts recently my acceptability radar isn't really in the best place.

[Ponder]

I don't think I was the only one offended but thanks for apology. I've been trying hard to keep things clean whilst going through a lot of drama myself. Comes down to practicing mindfulness I guess. No one is perfect as you can tell from my own reactionary fit. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/angry/smiley.gif Yea the Bands looks like they're going to be fun Jesse. Is good to mix up the activity. I bought a book on suspension training today. Looks like a learning curve, but you know me. :)

Thx again Jesse. Your mentioning it means a lot to me. Glad we can move on.

LOL D - Good Point. :) - hopefully that's my 12 monthly spaz attack out of the way. Been good otherwise. For the most part anyways.

[jessed03]

Good stuff!

Here's a song you might like, with a better message. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZzMw-O9mo0

Sort of an antidote to society and advertising.

[Ponder]

... Are We what we think we are? How do we know what we are if we constantly resign ourselves to saying "what is - is?" What is - is - but it's also much more than that, just as much as I am what I am, but I am so much more than that. Should we really just agree to agree that we are what we are and let things be? The Greys/Reptilians would love that. :)

To be honest man - given the recent wedge, there is currently nothing but insinuations in the that song for me. Thx all the same. I'm not out to save anyone? You'll have to excuse me, but I have had and seen too many responses handed to myself and others in a version of a song which more often than not is very confusing and unsettling. No one's fault - I've said a few times that my mental make up does not do well with lyrical songs and in fact mental illness is often associated to instability through such linguistics. I'd rather just talk up front for an antidote and go make myself a cup of soup. :)

LOL "I am what I am - I don't need saving" - Just kidding:

For instance - "I am what I am ... I don't need you to save me" and so on as in the lyrics of that song ... in contrast with your recent apology and then mix it with my own instability; Well if there is a message ... it's been lost to me beause I can't even get past the many other times people have responded to me with similar songs.

Regardless of the paranoia associated in that - I'm coming to dislike the phrases it is what it is or I am what I am ... even though I use it a lot. I don't really agree with it straight up like that. Needs more than a song ... I kind of explained above to the ongoing introspect that's kind of needed to make that common phrase more coherent.

We can change if we see fit.

Srry I was unable to relate. I do hope I was able to adequately explain my unableness. - Thx all the same.
______________________________________

Edit -I apologize to you Jesse inasmuch I was unable to receive.

Perhaps another book recommendation?

[Ponder]

____________________

A Snapshot I took whilst out on this morning's Walk - Mindfully So:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/265/32112460456_8a326360fd_b.jpg



____________


I finished that book:

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x30/davekyn/Minful%20eating%20jpg_zpsnxdyeg38.jpg (https://play.google.com/store/books/details/Dueep_Jyot_Singh_Mindful_Eating_How_to_Eat_Less?id =SklOCwAAQBAJ)

I took the liberty of linking (click on pic) to Google Play Books because of the download sample option. I buy mostly Kindle as for me it's much easier to convert into more usable formats for TTS and printing out info and guides. Here is the Kindle Link (https://www.amazon.com/Mindful-Eating-Less-Health-Learning-ebook/dp/B0164EUFTQ/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1483747467&sr=1-1&keywords=Mindful+Eating+How+to+eat+less), although it does not give much insight into the book. Instead I'll share a snippet for your interest D :)

First of all. About the eating Once or Twice a day concept I was entertaining previously. It's evolved more into intuitive eating for me as I am coming to understand mindful eating. A Great Topic that's inspired and motivated me to take control of my eating once again. After completing the above book. (Very Quick & Easy Read - relevant info for lifestyle and not fad diets - just a few bucks as well)

I found myself sitting down to this morning's meal and implementing a number of exercises from the mindful eating book.



I had a half a large cap of mint tea 15 minutes prior to eating.
Savoured the time I prepared my meal.
Split my modest sized meal (based on the 80/20 rule) into two small bowls - with a 5 minute break between consuming the contents of each bowl.
During the eating process I used my Non-Dominant hand which helped to slow me down and focus on the process of mindful eating.
Between each mouthful I placed cutlery back in bowl and lowered my hands.
I held my thoughts on each mouth full and did a body like scan inside my mouth (re Body Scan Techniques used in guided relaxation)


A little after my meal I finished the rest of my cool mint tea. I got to say that I was contentedly full - it tasted great!!! I'm looking to try this out regularly and will let you know how I go re my digestive issues as well as consumption in general.

I am looking at another two books [might go for intuitive eating ... not sure yet]

Mindful Eating: A Guide to Rediscovering a Healthy and Joyful Relationship with Food (https://www.amazon.com/Mindful-Eating-Rediscovering-Relationship-Food-ebook/dp/B00CS5KMAI/ref=mt_kindle?_encoding=UTF8&me=)

Intuitive Eating (https://www.amazon.com/Intuitive-Eating-Evelyn-Tribole-ebook/dp/B006ZL3P4G/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=)

Anyways ... I best go clean up my room. Finding a lot more to do in between meals which keeps my mind off food. You mentioned that most recently with your own doings and I find it also a great way to minimise all that excess we typically eat.

Before I leave I'll quickly insert the Mindful Eating Books Conclusion + add the useful recommended readings, Websites and FREE information!
__________________________________________________ _______________________________________


Mindful Eating - How to Eat Less -Health Learning Series by M. Usman

Mendon Cottage Books
JD-Biz Publishing

Download Free Books!
http://MendonCottageBooks.com

CONCLUSION:

There is no “right” or “wrong” way of doing any mindful eating exercise. If, in spite of all the effort, you still feel that your mind is busy thinking of something else while performing these exercises, there is no need to panic.

You have still learned something useful about how mindless or unconscious eating is a part of your daily routine, and how easy it can be to gobble your food, even when you are attempting to eat mindfully.

Performing these exercises once a day will change your experience from mindless gobbling to mindful eating.

Mindfulness is just like a muscle that might be weak initially, but with regular practice, it will become strong and more readily available.

Our physical, mental, emotional, and psychological survival depends a lot on our regular intake of food, water, light, sound, and love from our environments. How well or poorly we relate to these things will determine how happy or unhappy we are in our lives. ("Forgive the interruption BUT this really stuck out to me when listening to this book - I make post about that after I clean my room and or later on" - By Ponder : ) )

Mindful eating helps us to let go of our unhealthy relationship with food and eating and replaces it with healthy alternatives. With mindful attention to our eating habits, one can break the guilt and dissatisfaction of food and begin to cultivate the pleasure and satisfaction of eating.

Remember, it’s always better to practice “Mindful eating than Mind-full eating.”

_____________________

References: (I'm yet to check these out ... it's good to check out resources that you find in these little cheap books. Nuggets of info that go unseen if you're too quick and or impatteint ... this is the kind of enoucouragement we should be spuring each other on with - As I say ... "Adios, until next post. ;) )


http://www.quickanddirtytips.com/health-fitness/healthy-eating/3-tips-on-how-to-eat-less-without-feeling-hungry

Edit - I remove last two links as password required type of thing.

Author Bio
Muhammad Usman is a distinguished medical graduate of Allama Iqbal medical college (AIMC). He is a professional writer who has been in the field for more than 4 years. During this time he has produced 10,000+ articles, blogs, and eBooks on various niches related to diseases, health, fitness, nutrition, and well-being. He is a regular contributor to several journals related to medicine and surgery. He is the editor of several journals and newspapers.

Edit ... I Just bought Intuitive Eating. It speaks more my language. Will convert to TTS and share it soon enough.

[jessed03]

Oh, right, not to worry.

I just found it on a philosophy blog. Sounded pretty relaxing. Reminded me there are no answers to the big questions in life, and there's no pre-set destination we have to strive towards. That we should just be.

I don't usually hear such sentiments expressed in songs.

[Ponder]

John lennon sung something like it. Perhaps a little different; however was not long shot afterwards.

Anyways Jesse, I went out today to look what else I could include in my home gym. I picked up a cheap suspension training from K-mart. I think K-mart is like Wall Mart. Once the other one arrives I'll have 2 now so I don't have to fuss so much changing the strap lengths. Whilst there I picked up a few different types of foam rollers and also have a long one on order. I can't beleive how much I have been missing out on. I've been doing it all wrong! No wonder I have muscle imbalances and sore joints! I bought myself a medicine ball and discovered the term Plyometrics. (although like everything there is a caution to this type of training as well) I'll be going back out tomorrow to pick up another two medicine balls. I know I said I want to go the way of the minimalist and it sounds I have done the complete opposite as I actually bought more exercise/therapy gear that I won't bother listing - but the return is just how much more motivated I am and not to mention this gear is better for my brain!

I discovered that using a balance board is actually used on kids with ADHD (https://revbalance.com/can-balance-training-help-alleviate-the-symptoms-of-adhd/)! The principle is the same for adults as well - can help improve reading. Just goes to show how important moving is for the brain Although I just got a cheap round plastic one to start off with.

The more I have researched into Home Workouts the more I realise just how much my old school way of doing things has been hurting me. Although the medicine ball and pilates is nothing new. Just that the new research has now substantially improved the benefits of these activities.

I've been tempted to buy a small set of dumbbells but have decided against it. My wrists need a long break and the imbalance from using heavy weights in the hand hold position have places a LOT of strain on my forearms, elbows and shoulders. Just playing around with the medicine ball with open palms since getting it today has loosened up a lot of my imbalances to a good degree already. I had not realised just how out of tune my body really was/is.

I got pretty much all the gear I need now ... Just a lot of learning on psychotherapy and best routines for me. I'm not going to be put off with that gender garbage where people think one for of activity is just reserved for one sex.
________________________

This is the last of my money spent from selling all that electronic gadgetry. Lisa said she is glad that I have bought exercise equipment because the resale value is NIL and she has had enough of my buying and selling. :) - I have too!!! The mind body connection to most of this home exercises techniques I have been researching is definitely a hook for me. If I get a little hungry, I just grab my medicine ball and or jump on my balance board - cravings go away. I don't even have to use much weight!

Yep - I'm excited but not hungry. That there is the ticket! I expect when I get depressed that I can also do whatever 10 to 15 minutes session to help be get over it.

OK - that's enough off my chest for now. Today was a good day.

Over & Out.

[Dahila]

thank for the tips
One thing, Have a mint tea once a week cause it causes extensive bile production. You do not need it, I know your gallblader is out but your liver took the function. Now one day mint, another chamomile, then lavender, then citrus, chamomile or white or green tea, then mint. This way you are not going to overdo with herbs. i still think, at least it satisifed me; good purified water is all I need . I drink a lot between meals. Mindful whatever you do and the job will be done, This is the worst thing for me mindful eating. I told you a have a habit (all my family had) reading books while eating. I switched to smaller dish when I eat so the portions are smaller. but my shoulder is killing me............................Thank you for the tips D :)

[Ponder]

YW D. I can't say just how much better I am digesting my food and eating way less of it since practicing what is in the Mindful Eating book (https://www.amazon.com/Mindful-Eating-Less-Health-Learning-ebook/dp/B0164EUFTQ/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1483747467&sr=1-1&keywords=Mindful+Eating+How+to+eat+less).

Yea, I remember what you said about the mint tea. Although my liver took over the function of "extra" bile production, it's not suppose to be working that hard. (it's unnatural and leads to digestive problems for those without gallbladders - there are a LOT of people now complaining of just that fact on the internet; which is why stones are now removed more often before before things get to such an extreme .. . yadda yadda ... people still eat the shit and will learn the hard way no doubt ... addicts they be.) Add to this extra work, my liver has already had a very abused life from alcohol, extensive field pesticides exposure and factory paint powders that cause cancer and many other factory related poisons ... et cetera. It's not uncommon for people without gallbladders to have overworked liver and therefore take bile salts. I don't take bile salts as I am not convinced I need them (I question the salt content and or resulting constipation that ensues when I use them) when I eat clean and also eat small in accordance with good digestive practices in mind. (Mindful eating) ... Thus, It is that whilst keeping your caution very much in mind from your previous mention (I always heed your insights!) I am allowing myself mint tea more than once a week ... just nowhere near what I was doing before. I also offset it with a little raw honey + plus have it with food not long after and before my meals. That way, it's never on an empty stomach - as that variable is more the concern when thinking about rotting the gut or gut leakage or whatever the studies claims. I will research more into it, however not all claims are valid for all peoples. For the most part I take such reports as warning bells only and then see for myself. I'll restrict my intake and gauge it from there.

White Tea (http://ratetea.com/topic/white-tea-caffeine/59/) is actually a no no for me. The traces elements of tannins/ theophylline (http://helios.hampshire.edu/~nlNS/mompdfs/TeaTheoph.pdf)lead to constipation (http://www.livestrong.com/article/540185-does-tea-affect-constipation/)when I consume it. For me that is a fact and it takes only one cup of black and even the white tea does it to me. Is best I can say it regardless of whatever articles abound. I know that may sound crazy but there ya go ... Even the Green Tea (http://www.precisionnutrition.com/rr-green-tea-hazards) can be rather unhealthy for those with autoimmune (https://www.thepaleomom.com/3254/) afflictions like my wife Lisa. Nonetheless many of these articles conflict more so because of the changing dynamics with the individuals consuming them and how they consume them. I like Pure peppermint Tea and like I said, I off set by doing this and that. Nonetheless - Since your mention of it and its related issues, I have been way more careful opting out many times for ginger and lemon ... also using fresh ingredients to make my own teas. It takes time, just like using real leaves - but even then ... it's what is in the leaves and ingredients that counts, + all those dynamics. Like the PDF I linked re theophylline levels ... drinking tea is a scientific art.

I think I will revert to more mildly warm teas with fresh herbs and the like. I do seem rather sensitive to all the trigger chemicals talked about in those articles. White tea I don't use anymore - but have always remained thankful for your mentioning of it.

[Ponder]

PS - I PMed you re the Book. ;)

[Dahila]

D. there is one drink which does wonders for digestive system, as soon as you get up a glass of water with dissolved spoon of honey, raw honey of course :) yeah got the pm ;)

[jessed03]

I'm gonna try that Dahl. :)

And thanks for the book recommendation Dave. Mindful eating is something I've never tried but I think it'll deffo improve my relationship with food.

[Ponder]

I'll look into D. My morning ritual upon waking is Lemon Juice to assist my liver and prep it for the day. It's also good after exercise to help clear out some of the lactic acid. Half Lemon in diluted 250ml of filtered water.

I thought about honey, but don't want to taint the lemon whilst using it as a liver cleanser on an empty tummy. I am however using honey during other period on an empty stomach. Thanks for bringing it up. :)
______________



I've been busy reading up and editing pics from different books to make my own routines. Is going to take a few months before I know what I am doing with my new workout routine. I can tell you my abs are killing me!

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x30/davekyn/Workout-banner_zpsrtnmhwf9.png

[Ponder]

PM sent Jesse :)

[Ponder]

I had a productive day today which is helping to keep my mind off the fact that I'm being more mindful of what and how much I eat. I finally got around to changing my computer table. Since I spend so much time on it (like most other suburbanites) it was on the list of must do! Slouching due to incorrect desk height and incompatible chair position was reacking havoc on my rotator cuff (shoulder) issues. I also would build up a lot of lactic acid in my legs as a result of lifting my chair. Using a footrest is not as stress free as needing none. Now I can lounge around at an ergonomic height. LMAO @ that one. The chair pictured is actually quite a good chair. It also tilts forwards as well as in every other direction. Alas ... it mattered little having a table that was too high for me. Like I keep saying, I am a short guy and given most chairs and tables are built more for people say 5"8 to 6ft ... many of us others that don't fit that range, end up with major imbalances as well as our bodies being under constant stress.
_______________________________________________


Yep .. best thing I did was grab that table and grind 9cm off the legs.


https://c8.staticflickr.com/1/277/32085037471_2d9936e640_o.jpg



Please excuse my dirty windows. I've had too much else to do. Looks worse than it is due to the angle of the light. I'll maybe do them just to burn a few calories. :)

What else did I do? Fix the neighbors laptop, returned some items to a shop, drove Lisa around, dropped something off at my daughter's, filled the car up but then later had trouble starting it due to letting it empty too much but moreso to often. (fuel filter issue but all good now) ... I did some other things but too tired to think.

Best thing about today was finally doing something about the bad ergonomics on with my computer setup.

The mindful eating is going quite well. It's been challenging having to make time when I usually just do something else whilst eat. I thought I was good with that, but obviously not. Since adopting the mindful eating practices in that book, I am eating clost to only half of what I was before.

Oh yea, I had a killer workout at the gym on the treadmill. Been doing a lot of HIIT. 16kph spurts for about 3 quarters to a full lap as depicted on the treadmills display in track mode. I was doing intervals from 9k - 14kph to 16kph. My stretching is getting better as well. I think it's been more the "believing in myself" factor that's really helping me get back into sync. I was going through a tough patch and still am to some degree with taking on my others halfs fatigue. It's an energy thing ... speaking of which ... time for me to charge up for a bit.

Hope you guys are doing as well as can be.

Adio ... until next post. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/object/door-smiley-emoticon-emoji.png

[Ponder]

_________

- Morning Guys -

https://c5.staticflickr.com/1/479/31841087980_4de6b42fa4_b.jpg

___


No plans for today. Some passing thoughts on doing some weeding, kitchen chores, cleaning shed little by little and maybe a few other things. In general today's a rest day for my body. I know what needs doing inside and out - both externally and internally

Made contact with an old friend who's wife died only a few months ago. He is not much older than myself. It was an early passing, however his wife had been bedridden for quite a few years previous to her passing. She was a nice young lady that sadly was one of the victims to drug Thalidomide. It's a drug supposedly linked to Nazi experimentation that drug companies across the world soon took on board which resulted in thousands of mothers giving birth babies with → "limbs that fail to develop properly, in some cases also eyes, ears and internal organs. No-one knows how many miscarriages ..."

https://c3.staticflickr.com/1/638/31841528810_5cfda52fe6_b.jpg (http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-15536544)

Tragic. She was a good person that was literally debilitated from the start. Sad fact is - whilst there are less chemicals that are so obvious to the eyes that disable us like so, we still have thousands of drugs sold over the counters that kills us off and affect our unborn at an alarming rate. That's why I am so strongly connected to the phrase ... "THERE ARE NO CHEMICAL SOLUTIONS TO LIFESTYLE RELATED PROBLEMS!!!"

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/369/31376028304_8619dbdef6_m.jpg ... :(

[Dahila]

tragic, I got the first time to read about it, back home, it was years ago like 40 when it started to show. Unbelievable, giving something like that to pregnant woman

[Ponder]

Hi D - I'm giving this place a wide berth for now. To many health care professionals coming here of late. We have pharmacists, doctors and now psychotherapists. This place no longer feels like a home when the vultures let themselves in.

Catch ya on Facebook.

[Dahila]

I had not checked it in two day or so, just your thread, Everyone is pissing me off on forum :(

[Ponder]

D - I will link my new spot as usual ... going to start a new thread over at the weight loss forum I was once part of. Would you consider joining there if not only to communicate with me every now and then? I truly am done with this place. All I need is one friend to hold my hand from time to time. Sounds a bit weak to some, but what can I say ... "I'm only human" :) I would not of come back here had I one person I could trust over at the other thread I made. If you join me in my new thread within another forum unlike this one ... I'd be happy to dump this place for good.

Of course you can still do what you want with this place ... but I truly and sick of bitching about. I would not expect you to be there everyday for me or anything like that ... just knowing we have another place to meet up in other than this place would mean the world to me.

Having said all that ... I guess there is always FB ... it's just that I like to have my spaces to write in other than your atypical social media avenue.

Let me know what you think.

[Dahila]

Yeah I will join there for you ;)