Anger and anger issues

[tailspin]

Today is one of those days when I really just want to hit the re-wind button and start all over again. I've lost my temper 3 times this morning, each time a little worse than the time before. I feel terrible now. And this is a familiar pattern.

I'm weaning off Lexapro with a view to starting a different drug. I'm not sure whether reducing my dose has made my anger issues worse, or whether that's just a convenient excuse. The truth is I do generally have anger issues. I have a wicked temper and I'm not always very good at controlling it. Lately I just feel so irritable all the time and it doesn't take much to make me snap. When I say lately, I mean, over the past few MONTHS (so really it can't just be coming off Lexapro).

I feel embarrassed and ashamed about losing my temper today. I still feel kind of shaky and a bit sick. Mostly I just feel horrible. Yes, the last thing that happened was stressful, but still, I literally went bat shit crazy and my reaction was over the top by anyone's estimation. It's unlikely I will ever see this person again (I sure hope I don't!!) since this altercation happened with a stranger. But still, I feel really horrible. I was out in the park with my dogs and this woman suddenly appeared with her two dogs. One of them was a large German Shepherd and it suddenly lunged at my dog and pinned her to the ground (my dog is a black lab mix). There was a considerable amount of gnashing of teeth and growling, but my dog couldn't do anything really since she was pinned beneath the German Shepherd. I thought the German Shepherd was biting my dog's neck and I just lost it. I started screaming profanities at this woman and her dog like there was no tomorrow. I threw a stick at the German Shepherd to try and break it's hold on my dog. The other woman just stood there, doing nothing. After what seemed like ages I was able to grab my dog and I can't see any obvious wound, but I still continued to scream bloody murder at this woman. She got very defensive and starting blaming me for having "too many dogs". I just let rip and started waving my official dog walker's permit in her face. She walked off and I was literally screaming at her back.

If anyone had filmed that encounter I would be so humiliated to have to watch how I behaved. Even writing it out here I feel ashamed. As I say, I had already lost my temper twice today with two other people earlier (the first was with my insurance agent who is dicking around with a claim and the second was a with a rental agent for my flat in London who was also being difficult about something).

I have a real problem controlling my temper. I feel angry A LOT. And it seems to be getting worse. I just feel like I'm on the shortest of fuses. And it's really frightening to lose control like this. I don't hit anyone or anything. It's always verbal anger. But that can be bad enough.

Not sure what to do about this really. As I say, I'm already in the process of transitioning to a new medication. There is probably an anger management class I could take at my local hospital. I should probably look into that.

I'm just so sick of this constant feeling of being wound up and irritated and just downright angry at the world.

Can anyone relate to these types of anger/rage feelings?

[jessed03]

Meh, sounds like a selfish woman, she had it coming. Dogs get killed so frequently in attacks, it's a big deal. There are often fist fights in my local park for that reason.

Sometimes you just get burnt out, and lose the patience to tolerate bullshit, ya know? Both times sounded like that.

I get that you'd wanna get it under control though. I had that feeling for a while. I did some real bad things, stole money, fought people. It seems like one of those things you go through under the strain of stress and depression. For a while, I felt so vengeful I think I coulda beaten somebody to death. I just had a lot of hate, and the second I got 'crossed' by someone, I couldn't feel peaceful until I exploded and got it all out.

It passed, I don't think because of anything I did though, so, I guess like you said, getting in a better place and controlling anger is maybe the best way to approach it. It's so hard when you have so much frustration at life inside you somewhere... And then someone lights the fuse!!

I'm glad your dogs ok!

[tailspin]

Thanks, jessed! The thing is, my dogs are no angels. In fact, there have been times when the shoe has been on the other foot, though I do try really hard to keep my dogs away from potential problems. And I am always super-apologetic if my dogs act out. This place where I walk my dogs is a massive 10,000 acre wild park, so generally I'm pretty good at keeping my distance from people ;-) This was just an unfortunate set of circumstances. It happened near the trailhead. It's always at the entrance to the park that I'm likely to run into problems because that's where I'm likely to encounter people. I really should have had my dogs on leash at that point. But then, so should she!! Anyhow, as you say, the main thing is, everyone is ok. I just feel so shitty physically and emotionally from the massive adrenaline surge and from my resulting behavior.



I get that you'd wanna get it under control though. I had that feeling for a while. I did some real bad things, stole money, fought people. It seems like one of those things you go through under the strain of stress and depression. For a while, I felt so vengeful I think I coulda beaten somebody to death. I just had a lot of hate, and the second I got 'crossed' by someone, I couldn't feel peaceful until I exploded and got it all out.

Yes! That's me, exactly! I have become such a hater. So bitter and twisted. I feel sad that I've turned into this person. I know it has to do with generally feeling bad since when I'm in a good mood I don't tend to feel like this.



It passed, I don't think because of anything I did though


It must have been something you did though? Or do you think it was a result of all the things you did to help your anxiety, which, in turn, made you feel better about the world?

Thanks so much again!!

[jessed03]

It must have been something you did though? Or do you think it was a result of all the things you did to help your anxiety, which, in turn, made you feel better about the world?

I guess just breaking free in general? There was a point in my life I was so sick of the mental stuff. The anxiety and the depression. So sick of being in a rut, going in circles, and not really getting anywhere. I guess making ground on it helped my mood a bit, and that was enough. Maybe after a few small wins I stopped hating things so much and got my humour back.

You're a really good person; extremely polite, interested in helping people, a vegan. I mean you've gotta feel your anger is coming from a defensive place, rather than an aggressive place, right? Again, I mean, you've gotta feel that when you get angry, it's more of a defensive WHY MORE OF THIS BULLSHIT, LIFE? rather than a HOW DARE YOU DO THIS TO ME, egotistical type of anger?

So if it is the first, it's gotta be cause you're tired or hurting, right? Like the way a friendly dog might bite or scratch when it's in pain. But how to stop being those things is like the million dollar question. It's really hard. Takes a bit of luck too, just to get a few wins to lift your spirit.

Even harder if you live in Oakland or somewhere that angers likely to lead to an ass kicking. :p

[tailspin]

Even harder if you live in Oakland or somewhere that angers likely to lead to an ass kicking. :p

LOL! More like a pistol-whipping!!!! Or worse! :eek:

Yes, my anger is definitely coming from a hurt place. But it's hard to make excuses for it when it expresses itself in such an ugly way. I definitely have a very dark side and there are some big time demons vying for attention alongside the polite, friendly, vegan parts of me!!!! :)

Thanks, as always, for being here, jessed. You help so many people!! Thanks for always helping me too! Hope your flu is better soon! Though I will miss seeing you around so much!!

[jessed03]

Thanks Joanna :) it's not too bad now!

Pity you have vegan demons really, otherwise they could just eat the bad ones!

You said you're quitting your med, what's the next one you plan to use (if any)?

[tailspin]

Pity you have vegan demons really, otherwise they could just eat the bad ones!




:) :) :)




You said you're quitting your med, what's the next one you plan to use (if any)?



I was thinking of trying either Remeron (mirtazapine) or one of the older tricyclics, such as Nortryptiline.

I believe you were on Remeron for a while and did well on it? Was that after you had tried the SSRI's? Did any of them help you at all?

I've heard from others that Remeron can be really helpful for depression. But I've also heard that it can cause overwhelming food cravings and that some people have to quit because they gain so much weight. That is definitely a concern!! Did it effect your appetite?

[jessed03]

Yeah, I went on Remeron after trying SSRIs unsuccessfully. I was basically on suicide watch in hospital when they gave it to me. I took it begrudgingly, ready to give up when I had the chance, but within a week it started working, and I felt quite good, after just 7 days which is rare.

I didn't care about weight gain and stuff at the time, as I was in such a dark place, but I did add around 25lbs. You lose it after stopping, but it sort of shuts off the hunger centre in your brain, you NEVER feel full Lol. I could actually eat until I was sick, and still not feel full. And food tastes sooooo good. It's like the weed munchies 24/7. Makes you very tired too. It does get easier, but at the start, sleeping 19hours isn't that rare, for a long time you drift through life a bit, often in a haze.

But it's a close to a happy pill as I've yet seen. It has brought people back from places it doesn't seem possible to come back from. Very unique too, given it's the only drug of its class. It's one of the best meds for treating stubborn conditions.

I just don't know if I'd recommend it to you though. Given your life, and your hobbies. Because of what it has done for me, I'll never talk badly of it, but it's very hard to recommend to people, as it's a challenging drug to take, at least for a while, and for most people. Things do usually subside after several months, and they get much easier, but for some, the grogginess and gluttony never goes.
Makes you very happy though. That's why it's such a Jekyll and Hyde drug.
At the start it can make you very angry too. Maybe it's the hunger pains, or the tiredness, I don't know, but the leaflet inside the box has anger/aggression listed as a semi-common symptom.

Speaking of which... Did today run smoothly? ;)

[trinidiva]

I'm so sorry to hear youve been struggling. Dont beat yourself up too much....we've all done things we aren't proud of. I know on days that my anxiety is kicking in I can get really short and snap at my family. It breaks my heart when I see my kids faces look sad or disappointed and it makes me feel like a bad mother sometimes. I've had a good cry or two over it. That's why I decided to get back onto the Zoloft.
In your case, is the Lexapro just not working for you? You are switching to another med?

[tailspin]

Yeah, I went on Remeron after trying SSRIs unsuccessfully. I was basically on suicide watch in hospital when they gave it to me. I took it begrudgingly, ready to give up when I had the chance, but within a week it started working, and I felt quite good, after just 7 days which is rare.

I didn't care about weight gain and stuff at the time, as I was in such a dark place, but I did add around 25lbs. You lose it after stopping, but it sort of shuts off the hunger centre in your brain, you NEVER feel full Lol. I could actually eat until I was sick, and still not feel full. And food tastes sooooo good. It's like the weed munchies 24/7. Makes you very tired too. It does get easier, but at the start, sleeping 19hours isn't that rare, for a long time you drift through life a bit, often in a haze.

But it's a close to a happy pill as I've yet seen. It has brought people back from places it doesn't seem possible to come back from. Very unique too, given it's the only drug of its class. It's one of the best meds for treating stubborn conditions.

I just don't know if I'd recommend it to you though. Given your life, and your hobbies. Because of what it has done for me, I'll never talk badly of it, but it's very hard to recommend to people, as it's a challenging drug to take, at least for a while, and for most people. Things do usually subside after several months, and they get much easier, but for some, the grogginess and gluttony never goes.
Makes you very happy though. That's why it's such a Jekyll and Hyde drug.
At the start it can make you very angry too. Maybe it's the hunger pains, or the tiredness, I don't know, but the leaflet inside the box has anger/aggression listed as a semi-common symptom.


Speaking of which... Did today run smoothly? ;)

I really appreciate your honesty about this drug, Jessed. And I'm SO glad it brought you back from such a bad place. BUT........OMFG! It does NOT sound like the drug for me. What is wrong with my psychiatrist that he would even consider this for me??? I used to have an eating disorder. It was a type of bulimia. Not the type where you make yourself sick after bingeing, but the type where you compensate for your binges by fasting and over-exercising. Thankfully I have been done with that for about 12 years now. BUT, there is no way I'm prepared to take a drug that could cause me to start bingeing again. I'm going to have to speak to my psychiatrist again.

Perhaps, in his defense, I never actually told him about my Eating Disorder, since it hasn't been an issue for me since I've been seeing him. Plus, I just talk to him about drugs and we don't do any therapy. Anyhow, I'll definitely have to speak to him about this. I have an appointment with him on December 2nd and until then I've been emailing with him.

One thing I have been talking to my psychiatrist about is my anger issue though, so it's pretty disappointing that he would recommend a drug that lists anger/aggression as a common side effect!

In the meantime, back to the drawing board!!!! I am so glad I spoke to you about this, Jessed!! But unfortunately I am definitely going to have to strike Remeron off my list. Ugh. Old school tricyclics it is, I guess!!!! Either that, or maybe I'll have to bite the bullet and try Wellbutrin. For some reason I've always been scared to take this medication for fear it might be too stimulating and send my anxiety through the roof.

[tailspin]

I'm so sorry to hear youve been struggling. Dont beat yourself up too much....we've all done things we aren't proud of. I know on days that my anxiety is kicking in I can get really short and snap at my family. It breaks my heart when I see my kids faces look sad or disappointed and it makes me feel like a bad mother sometimes. I've had a good cry or two over it. That's why I decided to get back onto the Zoloft.
In your case, is the Lexapro just not working for you? You are switching to another med?

Thank you so much for understanding, trini. I feel that Lexapro isn't helping enough. It's mainly my depression which has been really awful again. Plus, as I say, I feel so tense and irritable all the time. I've tried all the other SSRI's over the years. That's why I was thinking it's time to switch to a whole new class of drug. And I had heard some positive things about this particular medication, Remeron, which I knew Jessed had taken and done well on. However, now that I've heard more about the way in which it has a strong tendency to make people want to eat all the time, in addition to it making people want to sleep a lot, that just doesn't sound at all like a good medication for me. So I'm going to talk again to my psychiatrist and try and come up with a new plan.

Thanks for asking! Hope you are doing better with the Zoloft side effects today and are starting to see some benefits!

[trinidiva]

Thank you so much for understanding, trini. I feel that Lexapro isn't helping enough. It's mainly my depression which has been really awful again. Plus, as I say, I feel so tense and irritable all the time. I've tried all the other SSRI's over the years. That's why I was thinking it's time to switch to a whole new class of drug. And I had heard some positive things about this particular medication, Remeron, which I knew Jessed had taken and done well on. However, now that I've heard more about the way in which it has a strong tendency to make people want to eat all the time, in addition to it making people want to sleep a lot, that just doesn't sound at all like a good medication for me. So I'm going to talk again to my psychiatrist and try and come up with a new plan.

Thanks for asking! Hope you are doing better with the Zoloft side effects today and are starting to see some benefits!

Its been a better day for me, thanks so much for asking. I just had to make sure I forced myself to eat....and even that got a little easier today. I even dusted off my treadmill and walked today. I felt pretty good once I finished. Maybe it is starting to work?

Have you considered adding something, like Buspar, to give you an extra boost? That's what I'm doing with my Zoloft. ..I also take Buspar with it.
I've never heard of Remeron.....but it sounds like the side effects might be a little extreme. How has the rest of your day gone?

[jessed03]

@trini: I've never tried Zoloft. It really isn't popular here, which is strange, as I know it's a massively popular drug in America. You were on it before, right? They say it's one of the best for anxiety and stuff, so hopefully it all settles down quickly for you. You just sign two months of your life away when you take an SSRI, right? Lol... Those first few months with the heighted anxiety, the weight loss, the nausea, the lack of sleep. The brain is one stubborn organ, doesn't like giving it's ways up easily!

@tailspin: wow, yeah, if you've had an eating disorder previously, Remeron doesn't sound like a good choice at all! Congrats for overcoming that! I know they aren't easy at all to deal with :)

[trinidiva]

@trini: I've never tried Zoloft. It really isn't popular here, which is strange, as I know it's a massively popular drug in America. You were on it before, right? They say it's one of the best for anxiety and stuff, so hopefully it all settles down quickly for you. You just sign two months of your life away when you take an SSRI, right? Lol... Those first few months with the heighted anxiety, the weight loss, the nausea, the lack of sleep. The brain is one stubborn organ, doesn't like giving it's ways up easily!

@tailspin: wow, yeah, if you've had an eating disorder previously, Remeron doesn't sound like a good choice at all! Congrats for overcoming that! I know they aren't easy at all to deal with :)

Hey Jesse! Yes, I was on it before, for about six months and it worked so well I thought I was completely cured and didn't need anything anymore. I am hoping it works as well this time around. You are right, you pretty much have to accept the fact that the first four to six weeks will be difficult as you wait for it to start working. Not fun at all. I've lost about 14 lbs so far waiting to get my appetite back......

Tailspin..how are you doing today? I didn't realize you'd suffered from an eating disorder at one point..with that being said...the remeron doesn't sound like a good fit. Hang in there, friend.

[tailspin]

Thanks so much, jessed and trini.

Really glad you're doing better on the Zoloft now, trini! I guess I am very lucky because I haven't really had too many problems with side effects on SSRI's. I generally seem to tolerate them well. The trouble is, they don't seem to work!! Or, at least, not enough.

My main problem at the moment is definitely depression and irritability. My day to day anxiety levels have been better, which I shouldn't overlook! That part is great. It's just, the anxiety has kind of been replaced with depression and anger.

I think that adding something to an SSRI could maybe work for me. I really thought I was on to something when Jessed suggested low dopamine levels and I looked up drugs that help with that and found that Ritalin and the other ADHD drugs do. I read online that a number of people with treatment resistant depression have benefited enormously when Ritalin has been added to their anti-depressant regimen. But my psychiatrist doesn't want me to go that route because he says the ADHD drugs can make anxiety worse.

I know some people add Abilify to an anti-depressant to get an extra boost. Those anti-psychotics are really heavy duty drugs though and I am very reluctant to go down that road.

Is Buspar for anxiety? I know it really helps some people. At this point I feel that what I need most is something to lift my mood.

Then there is the whole question of my age and hormones and HRT. I know some women swear by that......

Decisions, decisions!!!!!! Well, at least there are options!! I need to be grateful for that (and continue working on my attitude!!!)

Thanks so much again, guys!