so whats wrong with long term benzo use?

[biceps72]

I have taken small doses of klonopin for 15 years for GAD. I have never increased my dose nor desired to increase my dose in this time period. The drug allowed me to function in life. I was Chair of a large academic department at a large midwestern University for a decade plus. I wrote grants, published many papers, and worked out 2 hours/day.

As pretentious as that sounds my point is that benzos didn't turn me into a "zombie" nor did it make me so tired I couldn't function. I am fairly sure I could not have done it without benzos. I would prefer to be benzo free and am working on it with an MD.

My sister also suffers from GAD and takes a very large dose of klonopin/day (2 mgs!). We are both retired and we talk about anxiety all the time (our father had anxiety and took valium through the 1960s and 1970s). She is on a weaning program adminstered through her MD-- her goal is to get to 1.5 mg/day in 6 months and 1 mg/day in a year or 1.5 years. I admire her goals but she had a good career and a normal life taking benzos for 20 years with no side effects except becoming addicted to benzos.

I am not trying to start a "I love benzo group" by any means but I question the "I hate benzo group" people.

I realize we all are different. Benzos might work for me and be terrible for you. A few light beers could be good for you and horrible for me!

This is for sure----One size doesn't fit all when it comes to anxiety

[yujiaog]

2mg is a large dose? I don't think it is large, many people took 2mg for more than 10 years.

[biceps72]

2mg is a large dose? I don't think it is large, many people took 2mg for more than 10 years.

I really don't know anyone except my sister that takes klonopin regularly so I have no idea of dosages used. By reading here it appears some take it as needed, others take 0,25 mg/day, others take 0.5 mg/day, still others take 1.0 mg/day and others take >1.0mg/day. What be a large dose of klonopin?? >2 mgs/day??

[Anxiety beater]

For many people addiction to benzos becomes an even bigger problem that their initial anxiety - and for me, the problem with this kind of medication is that it justs suppresses your symptoms of anxiety rather than helping you actually to deal with it. If you're interested in really overcoming your anxiety, benzos aren't the answer. Nor are beers, for that matter!!

[biceps72]

but if you never increase your dose are you addicted sensu strictu????

[yujiaog]

I asked my doctor, how long could I take klonopin, his answer is for ever. And he told be don't worry about addiction.

But there are so many bad experiences I read from internet, so I am struggling too. Since my reason of panic is inevitable (my dark floater in eyes suddenly appear), I have to deal with panic everyday.

It is ok for me to take bens for ever, what I worried is someday even I take 8mg, it will not work any more. yes, what I worried is the tolerance.

Somebody any experience and advice? thanks

[yujiaog]

My floater is a long story, I had 3 vitrectomys on left eye, before the surgery, my floaters was like long strand, transparent, and a big dark dot on top of the vision, I went to UK oxford hospital, the surgery removed original floaters, but left some dark dots I did not have before the surgery, like ink dark dots, very annoying, that always make me panic.

So the only choice might taking bens the whole life, what can I do otherwise?

[biceps72]

Somebody any experience and advice? thanks[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=yujiaog;35389]I asked my doctor, how long could I take klonopin, his answer is for ever. And he told be don't worry about addiction.

But there are so many bad experiences I read from internet, so I am struggling too. Since my reason of panic is inevitable (my dark floater in eyes suddenly appear), I have to deal with panic everyday.

It is ok for me to take bens for ever, what I worried is someday even I take 8mg, it will not work any more. yes, what I worried is the tolerance.


Obviously it is best not to be on any medication at all; many people have beat anxiety using a variety of techniques. I am new here and am reading about success others have had and am impressed.

By the same token not all people can beat anxiety/depression without medication. These are often brain chemistry problems and not everyone can just "think" themselves out of their condition and I don't think it is reasonable to expect everyone to be abl to do this medication free.

Back to benzos!!

a. best = no benzo use obviously
b. second best = minimal benzo usage
c. next best = minimize daily dosage of benzos.

If I have to take benzos forever to lead a normal life I will. But I know that I will continue to try and slowly reduce my dosage so eventually I am benzo free. I would like to be benzo free in 24 months and have a plan (with an MD) to wean VERY SLOWLY.

I don't feel like a failure because I take klonopin daily!! I will feel like a failure only if I don't do everything (diet, exercise, rest, mental exercises) I can to beat this damn GAD!! Right now I need benzos and will continue on with my medication doseage regime.

[yujiaog]

HI,biceps72,

may I know how long have you take klonopin, do you feel tolerance, I took 1mg daily for 2months already, but i feel it is not as effective as at the beginning, that is what I worry about.

[biceps72]

Hmm of course there are chemical involved when it is the chemicals that control the body but if there is no medical reason why those chemicals are out of place then those chemicals can be controlled and changed by what we do . When we cry and get tears there is a different chemical make up between tears of sadness and tears of happiness .

You only need to look at the eastern way of life and some of the thing that the mind make people capable of doing . The mind is the most powerful drug that there is . It can over come alot or make live very hard also.

No one suggested you as a failure because you take drugs but i think it is important to see that the drugs are managing the symptoms and not curing them .



Sorry but this is not right . Everyone that has beating anxiety and depression has done it without the meds . They may use the meds as part of there tool box but it was once the addressed everything they needed and then removed the drugs that they truly recovered .

Many people take drugs , recover and then go back to their normal life only to end up back there ( me included ) because they dont do the work on the underlying cause .

Just for your information i was on Antidepressant medication for 15 years . Been free for nearly 3 years and i can asure you i have no special powers and are a simply person so if i can get there everyone can .



yujiaog




I am not being a smart ass here but have you tried to accept it and learn to live with it .

There are alot of people that have learned to live with some pretty bad things that life has tossed there way .
It is not uncommon what you feel but i do think there is better ways to deal with it .

cheers kev:)



I am a newbie here and trying to get along but I found your last post to be a bit offensive.

Not trying to be a smart ass but your comment "i was on medication for years but now I am not therefore anybody can do it" to be a bit self serving from a "super mod"

[biceps72]

Kev ---maybe you should reread your replies!!

offensive for example


1. "Hmm of course there are chemical involved" (you dumb person)

or

2. "Sorry but this is not right" (you dumb person)

or

3. "I am not being a smart ass here but have you tried to accept it and learn to live with it" (You dumb person should know what to do!) .

Thanks for all the great help Kev!



So is it offensive to say to someone that yes i had been on drugs for a long time but that when i was shown a better way that i started to recover rather than being stuck in the hole of anxiety and depression . That in fact you can walk out the other side.

No that isn't offensive by itself just self serving, i.e. I am superior cause I did it so anyone can do it

Cheers Kris:)



cheers kev:)[/QUOTE]





[QUOTE=forwells;35402]Hmmm

OK i will bite. Would you like to explain where that statement was offensive.
how about

"Hmm of course there are chemical involved" (you dumb person)

or

"Sorry but this is not right" (you dumb person)

or

"I am not being a smart ass here but have you tried to accept it and learn to live with it" (You dumb person should know what to do!) .

Thanks for all the great help dude!



So is it offensive to say to someone that yes i had been on drugs for a long time but that when i was shown a better way that i started to recover rather than being stuck in the hole of anxiety and depression . That in fact you can walk out the other side.

No that isn't offensive by itself just self serving, i.e. I am superior cause I did it so anyone can do it

Cheers Kris:)

[alankay]

If your dose is stable, you're not getting bad side effects(memory issues, etc), you're within the medically acceptable use pattern IF you need them and can't get relief any other way(in particular, IMHO). Yep, there are benzo nazi's out there, and with some reason. WHAT can happen is a dr. writes for these so much that to a patient he feels he can't cope without at all and/or develops such tolerance so needs to raise the dose and keep raising the dose until he's dependent(not just reliant) and is no longer safe to drive, has cognitive impairments, memory issues, etc, NOT good or advised. Discontinuing the drug will be awful(to say the least). Now that's not all patients or docs doing that(the vast majority of chronic anxiety patients don't) but it CAN and has happened. Soooo along comes Dr. Heather Ashton(likely never had a panic attack) in the UK and takes the worst case scenarios of the poor folks in benzo withdrawal(drs. were initially told benzos were safe/non-addicting when they came out) and now she has led a crusade against benzos for 99% of alllll patients using any benzos(or so it seems). Thank God US(and many UK) Drs. have taken the point in proper perspective and monitor the patients better so they make sure benzo use by the patients is therapeutic. I will say as a patient that you should use benzos ONLY when needed and at the LOWEST dose needed. The docs try to see to that and that's the way, I think, to best use them in addition to preferring patient use these short term only. In addition an SSRI can reduce the need for your benzo use as well as other non-drug techniques(CBT, deep breathing, relaxation, etc). Long term use is acceptable for those with chronic anxiety issues but should be done PROPERLY. Monitored and counseled on using the meds with respect and discretion. By the way, as you get older you might need to be switched to ativan(or other intermediate acting drug) as the long half lived benzo(clonazepam) can build up in the blood and might not be desired. But that's between you and your doc. I'm no kid and my doc said at some point going from valium to ativan might be prudent for this reason. I see why. Be well!!!! Respect benzos, not fear them.