GROWING OLD – misconceptions / acceptance and finding grace

[Ponder]

Just another rant - But I try to tread lightly - no offense intended.

1st to my friends on this forum -> my apologies for not first having caught up on your posts. I am feeling rather old about now, which is fine, however my pacing has been out of sync and left me more depleted than I was aiming for.

I will attempt to edit at the end, however in saying that I will have to shoot from the hip as I do with posts like these.
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GROWING OLD – misconceptions / acceptance and finding grace

Growing old – Feeling old – Being Old -> is no doubt relative, despite so many people attributing a number to classify such a condition. I guess that is just one misconception among the many that come to my mind. The generational gaps currently affected by such misconceptions IMO is making it harder for people to communicate -> to be understood and also to make sense of what’s happening in the world around them.

Hmmm trying to give context now -> I mean no offense to those obviously gifted and wise young folk in this forum, however I feel this thread is going to be more aimed, at those individuals who have lived longer in years, than those whom may typically be classified as more Vibrant on a physical level, all be it something age cannot always categorize.

No doubt suffering can acquire much wisdom in those who have made the effort to seek understanding by whatever means – unfortunately my own perceptions are greatly distorted which makes my delivery here rather cumbersome and I apologize for that. I am trying not to step on toes here, however – it’s just another one of those threads I need to get off my back.
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Have you noticed how pop stars have gone, from like 30 years of age right down to only 15 years old? How about those, in their 50s still popping it all out or babies taking classes on how to project their parents best, while grandma check in for a pregnancy test?

Remember when kids were kids & parents were parents and old folk where old folk?

OLD … omg… what a dirty word it has become … it tastes as bad as the word DEATH! Aren’t you just sick and tired of all the shining stars, and all the bull shit people are striving to become! Vote for me! LIKE- LIKE - Subscribe Subscribe – EVEN ME with my BS, “look at Me - Guru Posts!”

Here’s the thing! -> well for me I mean -> I know and hope some of you are getting this – that we do in fact suffer a predisposition to being continually negative from our long term suffering – growing old in a shrinking word with a increasingly growing population with no end in sight – with so many bright shining young stars and wannabees -> It’s so damn hard to find a grip within such a fast changing landscape – our planet has become alien to many of us still on it before our end is even in site. Hell, everyone is so busy running and hiding from the inevitable that whilst all this looking to the future and learning from the past agenda is indoctrinated – Society could not seem any more blinded than it actually is.

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzz The problem is just too hard – Lets give in and take the meds – and no wonder they are on offer and being fed.
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GOALS, MANIFESTAION, ENERGY, MOTIVATION, LIFE COACHES, HEALTHGY EATING, MEDITATION, GOING ZEN – VEGAN – SPIRITILISM and so many other prescriptions >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I don’t know – I am finding it all too much myself now – TOO MUCH INFO is not good a good thing and something we OLD weary ones should be careful off no doubt.

I guess Nature is just nature, and no more need to make it more than what it is, just as we should come to think of ourselves. I struggle with old people who subscribe to the idea of staying young, yet understand the health benefits in positive energy – BUT – alas it’s my predisposition I know that keeps me from allowing myself to overcome the dreaded beast of depression and tapping into some of that which light and wellbeing so clearly evident in those still suffering.

Hmmmm … there it is for me --- Defining the light in those whom are seemingly more proud in their health, rather than their - being. A sense of “well being snobbery” in those more able to emanate with an outward glow as opposed the old lady in despite the shabby clothes and crooked walk, produces a smile that cannot be broken by the falsehood of those that cling so outwardly.
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YEA! … Touching base with the suffering and accepting it in a fashion of grace! Brings the long windedness back to the title. It’s such a shame people miss the point in such seeing. They prefer to look on with a sense of pity, more than they do with admiration. How much of the good in human culture is slipping before ones eye. Plays to our predisposition – BUT – need not be so. This is how I draw strength by seeing such strong soles. Of course not all Old people are the same – indeed there are some very bitter people, even those that pretend with their things. BUT – what it is to catch the eye, nod the nod and smile the smile with those that know suffering well, yet give as they do.

I hope I can shake all this – GOALS – rolls eyes – LOL – such a pessimist Dave – but would not have it any other way – that I too, can shrug what must be shrugged and be there for those NOT so pumped up, motivated and all full of buzz ---

This thread is for anyone, that can identify – lest they be out shined.

Take care my old friends.

[Enduronman]

Wimsical, philosophical, metaphorical, analytical, dominant yet subtle, insightful, impressionistic, ablaze with an aptitude and perseption unparalleled yet moving,..to enlightenment, meaning, and a depth of thought if ever seen with an ability to draw the reader into, and behind the words to see the expressions of the people reading it..and oddly enough, I only had to read it once friend whereas I have always had to read other presentations time and time again. Brilliant.

I applaud your works, Dave..

Magnificent.

Chris.

[Dahila]

Well, well, to post this topic you must be sick with what going on. When I say I am old, people look at me with distaste. How dare I to get old and try to stay in work. The best would be to put all people over 50 in the reserve and put some armed guard all around. old people is such sick sight for young, motivated, energetic over 55 , looking like 35 from the side, full of botox and hair implants, a lot of implants. I should cover myself in my advanced age, not to sore others. I am soo much with you Ponder on this subject, you made a valid points. You are absolutely right.
BTW my Gp looked almost normal yesterday , her botox must be up in a few days. She could actually talk without making horse face:)

[Enduronman]

I asked one of the nurses at my Doc's office if herniated, bulging discs in my neck is a bad thing? Her reply, It just means your getting old. Didn't make me feel real good momentarily. What exactly is old, in your impression?...:)

[Lee Grant Irons]

Ponder, I agree that goal setting and pursuing is pushed heavily in our rat-race societies, and many people destroy themselves in the process. There are lots of coaches out there who will lead people astray with a rat-race pursuit of what people think will make them happy. Money, longevity, applause, recognition. And in the end, many people of such great acclaim end up playing out their sad unhappiness in front of the entire world. This is insanity. We are not businesses. We are people. IMO, there is a path of least resistance that I think is more conducive to one's happiness and well-being. It doesn't mean that we can't have hopes and aspirations and even things we would like to accomplish. Certainly everyone on this forum would hope to have their health improve. But the way one goes about it could be more destructive to one's well being than healing.

In the end, we all have problems, we all have hopes, and we all help ourselves and others based upon our own abilities and desires. Any given post of any person can be perceived as an attempt at trying to get attention. But in the end, who cares what some people think about you if other people appreciate your help. Different people are helped by different things and in different ways. We are not all exactly the same. What really matters is whether we have helped some people and whether we feel better in some way for it. The measure of a person's life is how many other people that person can touch in a positive way, just as you have done Ponder. The person who dies having had many friends is wealthier than the person with the most money.

Regarding your discussion of old people, I heard a radio report the other day from an African nation where 80% of the people are under the age of 35. The people in the government who were being interviewed were talking about how this gives them an advantage over countries with older populations because now they can apply wisdom to their country. I shook my head.

[Ponder]

Hello guys. Thank you for your kind words and insights. I hear you Dahila, and can see your reading me well too. Words are nothing more than sign posts, but how each of us relates to them, seems to be the deciding factor here.

If I could be clearer as to why, I made this post. I guess your right about being me being sick of what’s going on. (I’m also sick/unstable myself to much degree) I also think about what Lee has said (I hope you don’t mind if I call you Lee – Lee Grant Irons?) – I guess I am attempting to help myself as well as perhaps helping others who would simply like to identify.

There is also my struggle of late with the Goal setting. I thank Lee, for touching on this! Keeping up with such a “pursuit” takes its toll on those of us who are always found wanting. I guess in that sense it can ware people down and have us feeling old; as in the negative context the word is so often used.

E-man, you ask what is my impression of old is? Old is often associated with wisdom, however this seems to be more romanticized in stories, that it is, in actual reality. Old is something that most people strive to avoid, walk around, and seek to put aside. It is an image often presented after first being edited. I use to see older people as a great source of inspiration, great story tellers, and well respected people, Now I see them as rejected – lest they spend their life savings on holidaying and staying young. Where once it was about passing things on – Now it all about consuming to the very end.

They are not terms or contexts but mere facts in which I see getting about and on the streets, billboards and all over media. It’s not just about having teeth anymore; it’s how white they are and what insurance policies one has – what you own is what you are today. Old is like having nothing to show for your existence … it’s how someone in their 30’s living in the street with no reason to be seen, appears to be 60 to those that throw a bone.

Lee – I hear what you say about the worth of friends and having helped others and also appreciate your encouragement with that. I still kind of think that quality is better than quantity and no doubt will say that no having many friends – But I would like to have a few more than I do. Despite being very nervous when out in public to meet others. Those are little/Big goals perhaps worth working on for sure. Perhaps more realistic and practical. We went out as a family today to have lunch – we all joked about our insecurities as an entire family worried about our crinkles and how each of us would react. I’m glad we did it; I think each of us was, although we said things and paid out on each other during the whole process.

I have to re-read the last bit lee about the radio report – only because I am a bit slow understanding things is all. How is it they have the advantage? I know here in Australia – it is a Big Topic with our Aging population. I am thinking the punch line there is with “applying the wisdom” Again, sorry I did not get that, but could you explain to me please -

I think the attitude of many old people now are corrupt to be sure. Our bodies can age – however the fear that has been taught all those years in us does not grow old at all. The person we are inside never grows old – our inner self is always the same – and in that regard the corruption of humanity is a very sick thing – Actually Dahila – I’m just sick of it all – but appalled to see just how sick humanity has become.

But again – I’m just speaking out for the sake of making sense is all. I don’t mean to rain on hope at all. I do struggle with the concept as so conflicts with various Zen concepts – that part of me gets really confused. I like to just be and accept, however that seems to Hhhmmmm get messy with words like desire, motivate and such -

That’s another topic --- for me, how to draw the line or balance with feeling such things? (being- not investing emotion YET learning to love and be loved?) (not be cocky or to proud, but yet still be happy?)
I explain better later. I want to have a few goals but not the superficial stuff and I would like to make some new friends when I move to this next town. Indeed Lee – I would like to improve my help. Thank you.

Thank You E-man, Dahila and Lee (currently I'm a little confused - thanks again for listening to me and I am thankful for your replies :) )
Much appreciated.

[Lee Grant Irons]

I have to re-read the last bit lee about the radio report – only because I am a bit slow understanding things is all. How is it they have the advantage? I know here in Australia – it is a Big Topic with our Aging population. I am thinking the punch line there is with “applying the wisdom” Again, sorry I did not get that, but could you explain to me please -

Yes, it was the "applying the wisdom" part that was funny. These young people were thinking that they would be able to run a government with wisdom because none of them are old. That is what was laughable about that radio report. The older I get, the more I realize how much I did not understand when I was younger.

[Ponder]

arrr yes, now I understand. I also now understand such lessons myself. Unfortunately, I guess there are some things that can not be so easily passed on. I'm sure there is a metaphor for such a thing :)

[AmberGbenga]

This is amazing.. Really insightful and brilliant.. Coming from a 21 year old.. I'm young yes, but from my life experiences I'd say I have some knowledge.. No where near as much as many, but alot more than some. People my age, maybe older, maybe younger are so caught up in 'societies acceptance' admited myself included, I won't go ahead and get Botox but I groom and apply simple methods simply to make myself feel better and feel 'beautiful' which granted is almost impossible these days.. No one is beautiful, yet everyone is beautiful. Society makes me sick, and I see way to much violence and just looks down upon amazing people.. For bearing scars.. Everything included.. Wrinkled skin, veins, grey hair, stretch marks, fat, exhausted from child bearing, physical and mental scars.. All looked down upon.. We're as those flawless seeming get greeted as the wise.. That of an matured person could have had minimum scars compared to that of a 15 year old.. And ofcource vise versa.. The world has become such a foreign place.. I can understand from the point of view of others bought up in a time of difference.. I don't understand and I'm within the generation.. It's a hard pill to swallow. This thread is full of such amazing and insightful people.. You all amaze me and inspire me.. I am greatful to have read this.. Truely amazing guys :) x

[Dahila]

Amber you are amazing young lady and I love to read your posts. Young people like you have a pure pressure to look the best. You are on the hunt it is the way we are build to find the best partner to have the healthiest and strongest offspring. I can understand it, I do. I am old but I want to look my best too. I use make up, and hundred things to make me look better, however I am not making an idiot of me getting botox injections or others.

I am going to get my youth injection in a minute with my snow blower:))

I have limits with language but POnder, you know that I understand you perfectly, I think we have the same way of looking at this reality (there maybe more than one). I am struggling too. Let's see it is a matter of time when they replace me in work for a younger model, even I do my job perfectly.
Old age is limiting people, you have painful hands and knees, you can not lift things easily, back pain and others, the list would be too long.
When I look in the mirror it is not me, I do not look this way, I see myself the way when I was young energetic, and could run for ever. We are this way inside, with a lot of knowledge, (no one wants that wisdom anymore) this why old age and its limits make us furious. You can do plastic surgery, there are some promotions on it, but you will not change aging. The bs about real age and age you have, gosh it is idiotic.

Woman who feel that at 40 they are ready for a motherhood, 65 old fathers. What's happening, parents should be young to be able to run, to have fun with children, to introduce the sports to them, not to sit on the bench covered in gloves, glasses and hats, slather all over with sunblock, because their skin at advanced age is fragile. No one can convinced me that older parents can provide healthy and active childhood, they are able to provide the last electronic gadgets and new trends clothes....but it not the way to go to raise a healthy generation.

As always thank you people for discussion, it is the most refreshing and gives me something to think about, .....while I have fun with snow, because I am still able to walk with snow blower:)))
Have a wonderful day:))

[NeverToo...Fear]

It's odd with what's going on with the old and young. There are gaps, but the two categories still merge. As Dahlia pointed out, ppl who should be Grandpa's & Grandmas are fathers and mothers. Maybe the phrase, "Never too late" is taken to its limits.
It's a new world out there. And a lot of it seems foreign and strange to me, granted it is probably due to how I was raised and that I grew up with elderly people always being around.

The botox thing is weird. But if you are a celebrity and you got the money, I suppose nothing will stop them for trying to keep a youthful look..but is it just me or do they look scarier rather than younger? There is so much social pressure to try and stay young-- thankfully I don't feel much too affected by it.. Heck, I don't even wear makeup, but that's just me.

I try to see everyone's beauty on the inside. The outside is the hard, first impression exterior that we all have to look past in order to see the inside. Whether you are old or young, there is something beautiful and unique about everyone..the other day when I was in Walmart, I saw an elderly man sitting in the motorized chair, at the bread section. I saw something in him, the loneliness, the being alienated, an underlying beauty...I just wanted to hug him...uh, but I didn't want him being creeped out or be totally wrong and get hit on the head with his cane, so yeah.. :P If I had a camera though, it would've been something photo worthy.

Something that I see all the time and that really gets to me is the elderly being taken advantage of. When they get too old, usually everything that they had worked for gets taken away. Their independence gets stripped with age..goodbye house--And now move into a nursing home to where the state will take every last penny you earned and then some, and then they die alone and unhappy.. It's really sad, but this happens to so many old people and it just makes me sick..

I'm not sure if I'm on point or not, but I just wanted to say that it is great that you guys are here to share your wisdom, free of judgments at a place like this.. I can only hope to take advantage of some of it. Dahila, you take that snow blower and keep on walking! ;)

[Dahila]

The snowing does not want to stop. Thank you NeverToo..fear for the insights. When I was clearing the snow, I was thinking, yes it happens to me from time to time;:)
When and actor or celebrity dies, because of drug using, it is Breaking news in Canada, this is why I stopped to watch tv all-together. How can we expect young people to have a good life without reaching for drugs or alcohol or whatever there is so many addictions, when finding dead drug addict in the tub takes all the attention, it is underline, and there is of course Tribute to those people. There is so many of them dying, and their death caused by drugs or alcohol should not be breaking news. I do not care if Hugh whatever goes on the street and pay to the prostitute,.... Young learn copying old. Like puppies learn from mother how to relieve themselves outside (my did, after they went to new owners they were house broken)
We are shaking our heads but somehow we all of us are responsible for this situation. Sitting down and saying nothing is saying YES. We agree with everything what is out there.
Anyway I have before me white city and I need to drive it, to pick up my guests, Have a safe and wonderful afternoon, night, morning....:)

[Ponder]

Amber – I could not agree more with what Dahila says. This forum has many wise young folk that offer so much of themselves.

Also thank you for your words Never to Fear … I am always grateful to see you as too yourself Dahila.

I am back on my meds, as now with the moving is not a good time to mess with them.

I have to thank everyone for talking on these topics, as I know they can be rather depressive triggers for people, but if there is one thing my therapist has taught me, it’s to confront these things in small doses so they do not consume us.
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The Grandparents having kids this day and age, is surely a sign of taking the “Never too late” metaphor beyond its intended meaning ; indeed! Plays well alongside those self glorified Billboards of white teeth and sexually active couples in their 70’s - looking out over the cars driving by – defining what old ought to be in the 21st Century.

… The sense of justification hits hard on all of us to reason why it is that we give in so easily to the BS as so defined through whatever media each marketing company decides to use. “Oh don’t be ridiculous, we all deserve to be seeking bliss until we die”/ “Oh your sadness is full of so much Pain”/”Love Yourself first”/”ITS NEVER TOO LATE” …

Breaking News - Just in:
“Viagra for Grandpa!” / “feeling suicidal? – No problem, let -Instant Erect- Save your day! Da Darr – instant erect is also guaranteed to keep you going for longer and keep that smile on Nana’s face imbedded for days! Limited Time only – conditions apply!

COME ON? … Yes … it’s the real deal and the constant badgering of all these media blitz’s works its way into the fold.
Soon we will have Red light Districts FOR SENIORS ONLY! ... Pension Rates Available -> inquire within -> http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/flirt/sexy-eyes-smiley-emoticon.gif (http://www.sherv.net/emoticons.html)

Back later guys …
Take Care.

[Enduronman]

Thank you friend..

I had expressed a short bit of happiness today, which was nice of course, but not an actual expression of a real smile as of yet.

Your reply brought about both together, in perfect harmony and complete with a little bit of laughter..at at much needed time as well.

The gloomy doomies had set in for a short stay following what was meant to be an act of kindness and caring by my Father, I appreciate your help Ponder.

E-Man..:D

[Ponder]

YW, it was intended to induce some humor. so glad it helped. ;)

[Enduronman]

Young Whippersnapper, (46, Grandfather of 2), I suspect?..LOL!
Definatly humor inducing friend...:)

Please keep humor induction flowing, I need all I can get...

E-Man..

[Dahila]

I had to scan quickly but it made me laugh Ponder. Thanks. today I feel old, my friends left I had a wonderful time, my anxiety was up to the roof, but gin helped it. at least I poisoned myself in awesome company:))
Does guests cause anxiety for you guys and ladies?

[Ponder]

LOL Dahila ... re poison ... I don't drink much, bet a little sometimes. LOL at your comment though.

I only get nervous if I do not know the people then yea ... but if I know them I am not so bad - My wife might get upset if the house is not up to scratch, but I general don't mind, as if it's house is not good enough, then I really wont have them stay long - and they can stay away as well. I do like to have enough seats for people., but generally don't expect guests like that. I must admit though - if I was ever to get more involved with people and it would happen more often, then yea - I might fuss a little, but generally not. Mainly only the people I don't know about - I only like to have the people I invite come over - I don't like it when guest bring other friends that I did not know about. I have had to pull up one of my friends about doing that before to me - he used to do it regular as he was a churchy ... always trying to preach and bring others along.

[Dahila]

Ponder I do not drink, the bottle we finished was bought December 15, 2012 it was obviously hidden, and waiting for special occasion. I loved my guests and I have wonderful time, but at the same time I was stressed, I got a good night sleep, but today at ten o'clock in the morning I got my first in like 5 months panic attack:) I must keep my antisocial attitude:))
I do not have many friends and for sure not the ones who preach hehehe, I am not bad preacher myself, just the opposite of the church goings

[DodgingRain]

To me someone is "old" when they stop pushing themselves, when they give up on their goals and just accept things the way they are, when they stop fighting. To me "old" is about giving in to time. I don't see any reason we have to do that as long as we have some of our faculties at hand. I don't see "old" in any way relating to one's physical condition.

I also don't believe that the number of people we touch in a positive way is necessarily a measure of one's life. We each get to decide how we measure our own life and how or what that is is no one else's business.

So essentially don't give in, keep fighting the good fight against time, and make your life as closed to the way you want it as you can.

[Ponder]

Nice to meet you dodging rain.
Thanks for putting that out there :)

[Dahila]

I am feeling like friggin old today, first of all is snowing for over 12 hours, I had my appointement in the morning, I was so focused on driving, now I am tired, then clearing the driveway, and in an hour back to driving to work, still snowing.....
Who is sending the snow and cold here?
I like the thread is educational and funny
bummmmm!!

1004

[Ponder]

That's a nice meme - I like it. A healthy outlook indeed, yet I am not sure about my body sitting in such a position.
Wishing you well Dahila ... wishing you well ...

[Dahila]

Vice Versa Ponder, I am listening The books you recommended, and trying to harness my emotions, it is not easy..

[Ponder]

Today, I almost resigned myself to just letting be, but then remembered from much of the wisdom from those books I recommended - that being, accepting, and not doing is, not meaning to just sit in one place, but to actually make informed decisions based on my understanding - which comes from my current awareness and that Doing helps me to Stop. LOL ... although the sitting in one spot plays a large role too :)

Seriously that pleases me to hear that you have been taking some of that in Dahila. Thank you for sharing that with me. With my ups and downs I can only assume what a mad hatter I must appear to be, however those moments where the staggered line runs even, the beeps stop beeping and I look as if I'm dead; the relief that takes place is quite emmersive and how long I am able to retain such a position - comes from how much I attend within myself.

The author often says, or it stands out to me because I have replayed the audio over and over as I drive, walk and sleep - "it's simple BUT not easy" You hit the nail on the head when recently stating in the meditation thread -to the effect -> "most people thing meditation is about relaxation" -> something like that. Perhaps there is an element to that, but only after one learns to make the concentrated effort that comes with learning how to first walk. From that point, I would add to that the word complacency for those whom think they have attained anything other than the moment they find themselves in ...

It's all a new ball game to me Dahila with learning to live this kind of thing. It's not about striving, motivation, seeking, wisdom, betterment or being more than what one already is. All those things can come from meditating, however for me - until I can shake the conflicting thoughts that come about from such a driven and abusive existence, as I have known it to be - I will without a doubt keep running myself into the ground. As we get older, the ability to burn off steam physically can make the condition worse in our head. It's why the other day, I found it more amusing than anything else - to come across the statement, that the older one gets they wiser they become. Many will soon discover by way of such misconceptions, that in fact the heavier life can become.

Don't wait till your old, thinking that's how wisdom comes. For some of us, it's bitter sweat to see just how much we have missed in our reliance on such notions.
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There is of course another aspect to those of us nearing and already tagged as old, sick, unstable and disabled. That is learning how to walk all over again -

Dahila ... I know I must sound sickening as I write like so - but I'm back at that point in which I have to affirm to myself and be real with what it is that I address with the time I spend in here or anywhere I choose to sit and type or simply contemplate. Your support has been tremendous, especially your advice. You could not of told me to stop at a better point! Normally I would be frustrated for giving up with just a strapped ankle. But my Hives have alleviated for the first time in what seems like a month of more. Whilst I have put a tiny bit of weight back on, I can not tell you how relieved it feels.

I am somewhat thankful & content (perhaps a little joyous) to just be back walking - limping at that. --->>> All thanks to you (edit - the walking you - the limping me :))

Take care and wishing everyone well as can be.

Just Me.

[Dahila]

I do understand, Dave you will get wherever you want to be by walking, running is not always efective...it is overrated :)
I am not going to focus on the time I have left, it does not matter,,,,,,I am here, or there, I am....
I am thinking of limiting my time here too, it is time consuming and some of the posts simply take the calm out of me.....I get emotional..... the emotions not always are good. It is time for serious work, on me.....The simplest things are the most difficult.

For me letting go , takes a tremendous efford....to forgive is another thing I need to learn. I know I am making progress, but is so tiny is difficult to see. but it does not matter.. . We matter, and we matter....

[Ponder]

Yea - I think my running days are best spent :)

That's a good point about the time spent - and how it is that we give in and it's effect. I shall miss you, however then look forward to the time your able to give and use. I've really found this place good for working with my emotions, but agree, it can become rather taxing. Sometimes I get confused with all this talk on self forgiveness as I laugh to think that its not so much myself I aim to beat up --- LOL --- but it is true that such thoughts eat us up at any rate. Forgiveness no doubt is a healthy attribute.

I'm still cold in this new land I find myself in, although quite temperate outside. My wife's broken Leg has held me back and the huge stress still wavering a little. I'm still procrastinating on other fronts, however enjoy to some degree the space offered in here for me to write. I don't feel that comfortable walking down the beach and when I stray amongst that trees, it like I am walking through peoples back yards as the houses are built so close. I need to find new walking grounds where I feel more at peace.

Until next your able to find time. :)

[Dahila]

I will come to read the interesting posts not the childish and unimportant posts. somehow the forum changed with a lot of new people. They say new is good. Maybe not always. I am planing on making another eczema soap, it comes better and better. My son gave me a call he is suffering again. Have a good weekend everyone, and Dave say hello to your wife, hopefully the healing will be fast..