Is there a time frame...or not?

[Amy1981]

Hey guys!

So...it's been just over 2 months since I had my 1st ever, full blown panic attack. I am (supposedly) doing "all the right things", seeing an anxiety counselor, trying to lower stress, exercise, vitamins, meditations, plus using Xanax as needed (more days than not, but never more than 1.5mg in a day). The counselor told me that I have always been prone to anxiety (this is true, I agree 100% looking back over the years), and that I will probably always be even more prone to it, now that the anxiety had reach a peak, and slapped me with a panic attack, (I had never had a full panic attack before, although I now do recognize anxiety symptoms, that I didn't know were anxiety, starting at least 8 years ago), and that it will go one of two ways for me: 1) In a year or so, I will no longer need to use Xanax as one of my tools in my anxiety fighting toolbox (this is what I want, I despise taking medication to help control anxiety, unfortunately, I need to now, there are a few areas in my life where I have no way to reduce stress at this exact moment) or 2) I will need to use the Xanax as a tool, now and then (he said he expects I will at least get to a point where I will go weeks, months, or even years without using the medication), for the rest of my life. I know I should be thankful, that I have not been put on a daily antianxiety, or antidepressant medication...but I just don't want to take medication at all. :( I want anxiety to go away, and stay away, forever...I'm sure that is what we all want, and I know I'm kind of being a baby, and whining a little bit here (I'm sorry, it will only last a post or two, I promise ;) )...but after 2 months, why is the anxiety still pushing so hard? Before I had a panic attack, anxiety would push at me most every day, but it was a much lighter push, now, after the panic attack experience, anxiety pushes much harder, with many more physical symptoms, and it is almost a daily. It feels like a roller coaster ride. I will have a couple days where I take .5mgs of the Xanax, 3 times a day, then I'll have a week where I use .5mgs only once a day, then I might have a day where I don't use the Xanax at all, then a few days where I use .5mgs 2 times a day...there just doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason at all, I have not been able to identify any SPECIFIC trigger, for the days where I need to rely on the medication more, than the days that I don't. Is this honestly "normal", when 1st accepting and learning to deal with GAD?

*sighs* at this point...I'm just letting it frustrate me, and I know I shouldn't be.

Any words of advice, or encouragement, from those of you who have been dealing with this for a longer period of time? I kind of feel lost, like anxiety has slammed into my life, and is refusing to leave, even though it has more than worn out it's welcome. (side note: using everything I mentioned above, I am able to go about my day almost exactly like I did before I had the panic attack, so I am thankful for the counseling, medication, ect ect ect...I'm just feeling a little "ugh" about it all today for some reason :( )

Thanks in advance...and I promise my next post will not include whining or complaining :)

[Enduronman]

Its ok to whine and complain here, thats why the forum exist and if people do not open up and be truthful and honest and descriptive then Veterans of Anxiety (40 Years) have no direction to go as far as giving another member some advice, insight, learned experience, suggestions. I like that way you put that together actually. The fact that you're attacking this from multiple directions, quickly, aggressively is going to prove to be very rewarding in the future. As far as the (1st panic attack episode) goes, once "panic" finds its correct path, transmission, route, then it will continue to follow that same path until you get this under your own control. Although you'd mentioned that you were prone or predisposed to have anxiety throughout your life, it is the "panic trail" that you must find. Also, you mentioned that you can not (pin-point) any specific triggers so here's what we're going to do..

1. Type what it on your mind at this moment besides ANXIETY AND PANIC itself..Ready? GO!
2. How would you consider your physical health from your own perspective?..
3. What bad habits do you have if any?
4. What about family, friends, relationships?...
5. What are you vitals??..BP??
6. What is your age, and also profession??...

Answers=results=explanations=understanding..

E-Man..

[Amy1981]

Oh wow E-Man...I was so excited to see YOU had responded....until I realized you were giving me a pop quiz, when I haven't even finished one cup of coffee yet LOLOLOL! (Decaf, yes, just to be sure, even though in my head, I KNOW one stinkin cup of coffee does not cause anxiety, for me, it seems to heighten things, so I switched to decaf ;)

1) I am thinking that I wish it was sunny and not cloudy and raining (lasting effects of hurricane Isaac) so that I could take the boys (10yrs & 6yrs) to do something, anything, outside...its been icky cloudy for a couple days and we all have too much energy....

2) I consider my physical health to need improvement (I'm a total perfectionist), although health exam wise, I am perfectly healthy.

3) I probably have many bad habits, the detrimental one at this point though, would be smoking. I have never been a "dedicated" smoker, which is all the more reason I ask myself "Why the hell do you smoke around other smokers then, if you don't care to do it when you're not around others who smoke?"

4) Ugh...I want to see my extended family more than I do. They all live in a different state. My husband and I are going through a separation (I KNOW I KNOW, stress central), however we are on good terms, and there is no unnecessary tension, he has been extremely supportive, knowing that I am going through this. I do have a couple of other stressful relationships, that I need to end, no fun :(

5) Other than when anxiety is high, my vitals are all within "normal" medical range for my age, according to annual check-ups, ect ect.

6) I'm 31 years old (don't you know its not polite to ask a girl her age ;) ), and I am an insurance agent.

I gave the answers (even on less than a cup of coffee lolol), now what are my results, explanations, and understandings?

THANK YOU, for your time, on the forum....it helps more than you know....

Amy :)

[Enduronman]

Perfect and yer welcome!

One of our other forum members PM'd me lastnight and said "shouldnt you be out doing something you wanna be doing then sittin there reading about other peoples issues?". I said, "I am doing what I wanna be doing because it's therapy for myself to help others is possible because I spent the first half of my life destroying people and causing their failure so this is rewarding to me."..Weird maybe, IDK..but I like to help others that are particularly in positions or living with a condition that they can't quite explain or understand. I am a true Veteran of the issues I read of or about because I lived them all X's 10...

The only answer that causes me any concern whatsoever is the answer to #4. The "separation anxiety" whether you recognize it as that or not, it is..and it is feeding the anxiety but yet is obviously at a sub-concious level as you stated in your 1st post (can't pin-point a trigger). This is what it actually is. somewhere along the lines of PTSD even thought he is supportive to you (rare). Oh, and I can ask ages on here because I dont know you and you dont know me!! So, the information is only useful to us here as a tool, way, method, approach to find an answer.

Also, what are the "daily" physical symptoms that you've mentioned?..I'm just curious as it helps us to understand what, why, when, how and formulates the basis of many answers and IMHO (I rarely ever promote the following few words) I'm wondering why your Dr. didnt put you on a low dose AD like citalopram or fluoxetine??...

Your picture (thank you for coloring it prior to java intake) actually looks quite normal, other then #4 and "the other relationships that are stressful"?...

So:
1. Elaborate on number 4 abit?
2. Did Dr. suggest AD's at any time?
3. How long ago was the parting of ways??

E-Man :)

[dazza]

Hi Amy

I'm sure E-Man will nail this one for you, but, if I may throw in my 1 euro's worth meantime...

>I have not been able to identify any SPECIFIC trigger, for the days where I need to rely on the medication more, than the days that I don't. Is this honestly "normal", when 1st accepting and learning to deal with GAD?

From my 8 month experience of anxiety disorder I can categorically say "Yes, it's normal"

By definition, a disorder means "something's gone wrong or not in order" and in your (& most other forum users) case, that something happens to be your brain, in particular, the part(s) which deal with anxieties, worries & fears.

In fact, when the disorder first develops - there is often NO dealing process whatsoever. The anx./worries/fears short-circuit straight from conception, skipping over rationality and straight to action, where action is fight or flight mode - the god-awful, primitive response which, for so many of us causes such wierd physical & mental symptoms.

With this in mind, we must recognise that fight or flight is pretty much just "around the corner" for almost every thing you do. It's there, lurking... waiting.

Just a mildly stressful day, which would otherwise (pre-anxiety-disorder) be a doddle to handle, can and does now trigger the all-to-easily provoked fight or flight.

Reduce stress? yes... ideally to minimum if not ZERO if this is humanly possible.

Reduce energy? yes... caffeine, sugar, etc. will help a little since energy feeds anxiety somewhat.

As you get better, you'll find that fight or flight will continue to try it's luck, but you'll find yourself increasingly making conscious, rational decisions which keep it at bay.

If all goes well, these forced rational thought processes will eventually re-embed themselves into your spongey brain, and will become an automatic part of the thought processes once again, stopping fight or flight from being reached.
When this day comes, you will be fully recovered.

[Enduronman]

YAY!! Where you been Dazzler?...S**t I thought we lost you to some rabid Kangaroo er something!! Glad to see you bruh....Be back shortly, shopping time for me (as this is part of my routine to keep anxiety away) same time, same store,...:)

Enduronman.

[dazza]

>YAY!! Where you been Dazzler?

I do have a life outside of this forum ya know! lol

>shopping time for me (as this is part of my routine to keep anxiety away) same time, same store

Enjoy your anxiety-free shopping trip :-)

[jhunter89]

Only kangaroos I seen are in London zoo haha.

[Enduronman]

Thanks Dazzlet!!.. London?..LMAO!!!

Shopping is DONE!

Enjoy this day friends!

[Amy1981]

The only answer that causes me any concern whatsoever is the answer to #4. The "separation anxiety" whether you recognize it as that or not, it is..and it is feeding the anxiety but yet is obviously at a sub-concious level as you stated in your 1st post (can't pin-point a trigger). This is what it actually is. somewhere along the lines of PTSD even thought he is supportive to you (rare). Oh, and I can ask ages on here because I dont know you and you dont know me!! So, the information is only useful to us here as a tool, way, method, approach to find an answer.

I answered this in my reply to your PM, so won't go into it again here :)


Also, what are the "daily" physical symptoms that you've mentioned?..I'm just curious as it helps us to understand what, why, when, how and formulates the basis of many answers and IMHO (I rarely ever promote the following few words) I'm wondering why your Dr. didnt put you on a low dose AD like citalopram or fluoxetine??...


They "daily" physical symptoms, some days are worse than others, a few days here and there with none, are mainly just a feeling of uneasiness, butterflies in my stomach, occasional facial tingly/numbness if I let the anxiety stay in control for too long. Increased heart rate, shakiness, (but not to the extent of a full panic attack, however would probably lead to one), again if I don't act on the anxiety soon enough, I know, not very interesting to most here, I'm sure :( When these physical symptoms are at their worst, I also really don't feel like doing anything, like, I just want to come home from work, and kick back and do nothing, that probably isn't concerning to most people, but in my mind, I worry it means things are getting worse, instead of better. I know that depression, very often goes hand in hand with anxiety, and I have asked the counselor if I was depressed, and he said I am too happy to be depressed. I hide things super well, but I'm going with my gut feeling that he would pick up on depression if it was there. He has been mental health counseling for over 30 years, and he and I mesh very well (when I'm not plotting to toss his ass into the lake right outside the office, because he is pushing me to my limits ;) )

I honestly dont know if an AD medication would be right for me...some days I think it would make dealing with this easier, therefore, give me more energy to want to do other things, because it really is actually hard, treating anxiety, with Xanax, just "as needed"....because really, what is "as needed"? It is a constant mental guessing game for me, "is the anxiety strong enough right now to call for the meds, or should I wait it out a little longer? Those mental guessing games are exhausting some days.

Amy :)

[Amy1981]

DAZZA!! Another one of my favorites to read :) :)

Thanks for the reply...

Right now, I guess I'm just kind of feeling "stuck". I have gotten to the point where I accept this for what it is, and I accept the methods I have chosen to fight back, including the use of Xanax, even though that was a fight in the beginning. I didnt want to take medication, at all, period, and didnt for about a month after I had the panic attack, however, by NOT using the meds as a tool to help me regain the upper hand, the mental fight to keep anxiety at a level that I didnt have another panic attack, was not only exhausting, but it was also causing some depression I think. I would cry, every night, because I was just so freakin tired of talking myself down, and fighting the anxiety. I no longer cry, because I have accepted the meds as an ally for now...so I dont get quite as exhausted when I decided to fight back on my own, with no medication help, which I do more than I should at this point, according to the counselor. He has asked me to use the meds, every time I cannot control the anxiety in a short time period, every single time, during the first 6-12 months of CBT. I however, am a rebel ;) ... and sometimes will choose to have a staring contest with the little peach pill, when I feel the anxiety pushing, I'll look at the pill, and remember how much I do not want to take it, it has worked for me, however when I tried telling the counselor how proud I was of myself, for winning this "staring" contest, he immediately reprimanded me, (I do not take offense to this, he is very hard on me, but that is what I need, I am not the type who can just be patted on the head & told everything will be okay, I am super independent, very strong willed, and not easily convinced :) ) and told me that at only 2 months in, I am more likely to get caught up in a tug of war with myself, by using this type of method to try & control the anxiety, right now, he prefers I take the medication, every single time. YUCK.

What are your thoughts on this?

Amy

[Enduronman]

Got it Amy! Beautifully presented by the way..I will be sending some suggestions your way shortly too and I hope you're able to actually "see" what's going on in my last PM..It's ALL right there friend.. I'm going to send recommedations for a few things other then little peach .5's also.. You're going to be fine!! :)

E-Man.

[Amy1981]

HEY!!! I just figured out my time frame. I want the physical symptoms of anxiety, to exit my life, as fast as they entered, and I want that to happen RIGHT NOW! Think it will happen? :):)

I can wish...

Amy

[Enduronman]

Yes. because now you know exactly how and where they entered. All you gotta do now is open the door...to a new life and a hugely successful accomplishment. It's all right in front of you.. Attack the demons just as they did you, then let me know when the battle is over so I can put another slash on this chalkboard!! Congratulations Amy!!! :)

E-Man.

[j2005]

So what are your symptoms of anxiety?

[Amy1981]

So what are your symptoms of anxiety?

Hi j2005 :)

Physical symptoms are MAINLY, a complete sense of "uneasiness", is the best way I can describe it. I get the adrenaline rush, that continues over and over and over, causing increased heart rate, & the need to "breathe deeply", butterflies in my stomach, that feeling of "whoa something just startled me", which is prolonged, & doesn't like to go away on its own. I also get a feeling of numbness/tingling, mainly in my facial muscles. I get LOTS of muscle twitches, pretty much body wide. Also, when anxiety is high, I have a super hard time concentrating, on ANYTHING. Also, I don't have any energy, all I want to do is curl up & relax. I know there are more physical symptoms that I am missing, honestly, for the most part, every single physical symptom I have read about here, I have experienced at one point in time over the last 8 years. I by no means am a newbie to anxiety, I however am a newbie to panic. I had a not so fun battle with health anxiety, a few years back, when the muscle twitching started, & I, like an idiot (lolol), googled muscle twitches...we all know what google tells us, when we google something like that. I was CONVINCED, for about 2 months, that I was certainly going to die some horrible death. I was super lucky, to find another forum, that specifically addressed "benign" muscle twitches, & the vets over there, were just as good as they are here, & I beat the health anxiety fairly quickly, within a week or so, of talking things through with others, who have had muscle twitches for a long long time. Since then, I still have occasional health anxiety, however, I am super fortunate that I am able to immediately (most every time), dismiss the health concerns, because I KNOW, without a doubt, it is anxiety causing ALL of these physical symptoms.

Hope that helps :)

Amy

[dazza]

You'll find many anxiety disorder sufferers who have managed to stop panic attacks and, to a conscious degree, most of their anxiety, continue to suffer physical symptoms for some time after.

For a sufferer who has had anxiety disorder & panic attacks for some time, the brain has tuned to these conditions and unfortunately, panic or fight/flight mode has become second nature and almost as automatic, subconscious a reaction as blinking.

Sorry, but it's true.

This is the hardest bit to overcome. This is the fucker that's continuing to plague me.
It's the last, exhaustive round in this anxiety boxing match, but I've a feeling it's going to be a long old slug.

[Amy1981]

You'll find many anxiety disorder sufferers who have managed to stop panic attacks and, to a conscious degree, most of their anxiety, continue to suffer physical symptoms for some time after.

For a sufferer who has had anxiety disorder & panic attacks for some time, the brain has tuned to these conditions and unfortunately, panic or fight/flight mode has become second nature and almost as automatic, subconscious a reaction as blinking.

Sorry, but it's true.

This is the hardest bit to overcome. This is the fucker that's continuing to plague me.
It's the last, exhaustive round in this anxiety boxing match, but I've a feeling it's going to be a long old slug.

Dazza!! :)

Do you take any medications?

Amy

[dazza]

Dazza!! :)

Do you take any medications?

Amy

Good question...

I did. I toggled between beta-blockers and, where absolutely necessary: diazepam (which works wonders I must add)

I've as good as stopped ALL medication for now on a trial run, but I do sometimes wonder whether diazepam in particular will help in this final round.

I'm contentious of meds - my cautious & logical side says "meds only mask mental illness, not cure it". My suffering side says "meds DO help to achieve absolute calm"

I must admit, I wonder whether by leaving myself med-free - I'm actually doing more harm than good.

It's possible that fight or flight mode itself can only be defeated through ultimate calm, which can only be more readily achieved with medication.

I dunno... I'm experimenting.

[Amy1981]

I agree 100%...about the ultimate, complete calm, being achieved best with the use of medication. It is the only reason I have accepted the use of Xanax...as I said in my 1st post on this thread, it is such a roller coaster ride, the days I use meds, the days I dont, the number of times I need to use the meds throughout the days that I do use them. I am 99% AGAINST meds, and put up a fight worthy of a WWF title, but in the end, thankfully, I learned I honestly was doing myself more harm than good. Xanax is right for me, because I do not have a tendancy to become dependant, and I dont need to use a high enough dose to even worry about addiction or dependency. I have wondered before, if a daily AD medication would be good for me, I would DESPISE taking it, but it is for real A LOT of work, managing anxiety "as needed"...it means that right now, virtually daily, the anxiety is allowed to push me around, until I feel its bad enough to use the meds, and honestly, I fight the anxiety mentally, way more than I should. A daily AD med would take that fight for me, and it wouldnt be so mentally exhausting, however, my counselor, (and E-Man lolol) have advised AGAINST a daily AD med for me...Im not 100% sure why, but I feel they are both probably right. Maybe E-Man can explain it better, and I honestly dont mind if he does, because logically, if relief can be achieved for panic, this early in the fight (2 months), WHY the hell wouldnt it be the right answer...but for some reason, its just not, for me....

:) Amy

[Enduronman]

Simple answer? The particular and specific medication you have been prescribed is a dual-purpose medication and perfectly synthesized chemical composition. It acts as a (anti-depressant/anti-anxiety) all in (1) form. It is literally perfect for YOU in this specific time, event, issue that has been presented to you in your life. You in particular, need this anxiety for a purpose (others may not understand why, but there is a reason it is useful to you at the moment and will be of great benefit for the intended purpose or goal you're going to obtain)..Generally, in 99% of other friends, members, posted threads, I would find the best way to rid the individual of the effects of anxiety but again as I typed here, Amy needs this for this particular subject matter..An important tool, leverage, weapon, and abit of norepinephrine will serve her well here. This situation is unique to Amy, and only Amy and an addition of an AD would actually do her more harm then good in the big picture and her future life. She must be able to "see" everything at "face value" at the moment but not for much longer though either, it is all going to change very quickly and Amy knows exactly what to do with the issues and battles she faces. Besides, it isnt depression she has to begin with and it would take 4 to 6 weeks to reach full blood concentrations and knowing what I do know of you Amy..you'd hate it even more anyway...So,..GET YER PARTY STARTED, AND FINISHED FRIEND!!!...Save me a bloody mary for the celebration please...YAY!!

Enduronman...:)

[Amy1981]

Simple answer? The particular and specific medication you have been prescribed is a dual-purpose medication and perfectly synthesized chemical composition. It acts as a (anti-depressant/anti-anxiety) all in (1) form. It is literally perfect for YOU in this specific time, event, issue that has been presented to you in your life. You in particular, need this anxiety for a purpose (others may not understand why, but there is a reason it is useful to you at the moment and will be of great benefit for the intended purpose or goal you're going to obtain)..Generally, in 99% of other friends, members, posted threads, I would find the best way to rid the individual of the effects of anxiety but again as I typed here, Amy needs this for this particular subject matter..An important tool, leverage, weapon, and abit of norepinephrine will serve her well here. This situation is unique to Amy, and only Amy and an addition of an AD would actually do her more harm then good in the big picture and her future life. She must be able to "see" everything at "face value" at the moment but not for much longer though either, it is all going to change very quickly and Amy knows exactly what to do with the issues and battles she faces. Besides, it isnt depression she has to begin with and it would take 4 to 6 weeks to reach full blood concentrations and knowing what I do know of you Amy..you'd hate it even more anyway...So,..GET YER PARTY STARTED, AND FINISHED FRIEND!!!...Save me a bloody mary for the celebration please...YAY!!

Enduronman...:)


Brilliant! Basically, what our E-Man is saying, is the panic attacks, and physical symptoms of anxiety, are NEEDED by me right now!! (I'm NOT disagreeing with this, it is within my control, I just need to force my hand)...however, that being said, I think Red Wine is also NEEDED by me at this exact moment....anyone want to join me? :)

;) Amy

[Enduronman]

Heck yeah!! Email me a glass please!!! YAY!!!

Enduron...dood

[Amy1981]

Heck yeah!! Email me a glass please!!! YAY!!!

Enduron...dood

*Emailing E-Man TWO glasses of Red Wine*....hopefully he will get sleepier than me hehehehehe :):)

;) Amy